There will never be a level playing field in MMA
by The real Philo on Jan 29, 2012 12:04 PM EST
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I don't think a level playing field is even necessarily desirable. Picture two perfectly matched opponents cancelling every maneuver and strength, essentially engaging in a stalemate. Complete parity would make fights boring.
There are a lot of variables that contribute to a fighter's advantage. There is talent, physical build, coaching, teammates, experience in the cage, length of time competing, mindset, work ethic, financial backing, and medical attention to name a few.
However, there are two topics that just have to be addressed: Steroids and weight cutting.
Recently there have been a couple failed drug tests, and a big time failure at a weight cut. All three incidents raised the question of what needs to be done.
Purportedly, there are a number of fighters already on TRT, which segues right into what seems like an obvious solution. Establish a baseline level of testosterone that is equal to the highest naturally occurring level accepted by the medical community, and let everyone supplement to that standard. Of course this would require medical supervision, and the UFC should be the one to provide for such monitoring.
Now for the weight cutting. I think there should be a standard weight for each weight class that would have to be met and maintained two weeks out from an event so that a fighter could only cut a fixed percentage of weight from there. The percentage would be based on a mild sliding scale to compensate for increasing weight classes.
I think both of these ideas would serve to protect the fighters' health, and provide for better competition and performance.
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Agree completely
TRT is just cheating. Testosterone is what makes men muscular, strong and aggressive, so it is clearly performance-enhancing. Anabolic steroids are just synthetic forms of testosterone.
On weight-cutting, this was discussed recently in depth. You;re right, it is an absolute travesty. When Chris Weidman has to cut 32 pounds in ten days, you have to admit there is something seriously wrong with the system. A fighter should be focusing on getting fit and refining their strategies before a fight, not dehydrating themselves to the point that they risk their health and can barely fight.
And why do they do it? This quote from this recent story says it all:
Well we used to weigh in on the day of most of our fights and we never really thought about it. Now though I see guys at welterweight and they look huge, Gregor Gracie for example. So dropping down in weight seemed like the sensible thing to do as everyone else is doing it.
They do it because everyone else is doing it, and if they don’t do it they end up fighting bigger guys. It’s a race to the bottom, and only the authorities can stop it.
TRT is not cheating, using it to have above normal levels is cheating.
Now, count up your crimes!
by Cyclonejoker on Jan 29, 2012 2:01 PM EST up reply actions
okay?
but if youre doing TRT that means that your body produces less than it should…you know nothing
If you think, you are late
If you are late, you use strength
If you use strength, you tire
And if you tire, you die
if youre doing TRT that means that your body produces less than it should
Or you’re trying to cheat. Did you consider that? What percentage of the general population suffers from natural testosterone deficiency? Now, what percentage of UFC fighters are on TRT? That’s right- the percentage is much higher. Considering the incentive to increase your performance using testosterone, isn’t it slightly suspicious that so many UFC fighters just happen to suffer from hormone deficiency? It certainly smells suspicious to me.
Unless you are walking around with man-boobs, have no pubic hair and can’t grow a beard, you have enough natural testosterone. Real hormonal deficiency is extremely rare These guys are just using a loophole to juice up.
You missed the point, if you're using it enough to be cheating then you'll get busted just like Nate did.
And you argued his point by pretty much telling him he didn’t consider they’re cheating. Well have you considered that maybe they actually do have low levels of testosterone? I said it before and I will say it again, TRT is not cheating unless you use it to make your levels highers than what’s allowed.
Now, count up your crimes!
by Cyclonejoker on Jan 29, 2012 3:22 PM EST up reply actions
See my additional comment.
If you are healthy and under 40 (like the typical UFC fighter) and doing TRT, you are almost certainly cheating, because the chances of you suffering from real testosterone deficiency is close to zero.
hard science, hard fact.
except when you only have one testicle
and im only halfway joking
"Here we are with Seraldo Babalu, you did an awesome job, saw why you’re a black belt in jiu-jitsu, getting an awesome submission there, I want to tell me what you see, let’s go ahead and see by the fight, what you saw, in the ring." - Tito (the Head) Ortiz - Great Commentator, or Greatest Commentator.
"GSP is me."
by El Pablo Diablo on Jan 30, 2012 4:22 PM EST up reply actions
And to save you the trouble of doing research...
From Wikipedia (on TRT):
There is the possibility of abuse: some athletes may demand far higher levels of androgen than normal in order to out-perform others
Secondly, from Science Daily:
only 5.6 percent of the male population, actually suffer from low testosterone accompanied by clinical symptoms. That percentage, however, rises substantially with age
Since 5.6% is the incidence among all men, and the percentage rises sharply with age, then the incidence among young men (the typical UFC fighter) is substantially below 5.6%. Normally, testosterone levels don’t begin to decline until after the age of 40, so it is for certain that most UFC fighters do NOT have testosterone deficiency.
-The guy who knows nothing.
All fighters for the most part are on the juice
Who gives a fuck
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by randallhumpfreeze on Jan 29, 2012 3:37 PM EST up reply actions
i say they should just be allowed to..
lots of the things are just for healing faster..or cutting water..yeah yeah short cuts..but these athletes put their bodies through hell for this sport..BUT it should be known what they take so it’s an even playing field..lol
and juice will in the end have its toll on your body sarah. Now not everyone wants to damage their body from these drugs.
But the ones who don’t give a fuck and live in the moment only will be juiced and have an unfair advantage imo.
That's the reason for the cap one T levels
If there were a limit to the amount of hormone fighters could have in their system, a level that is the high end of normal, they wouldn’t be suffering the effects of gross abuse. And, if other fighters chose not to supplement, the advantage for those who did would be minimal.
by The real Philo on Jan 29, 2012 5:04 PM EST up reply actions
now normal people and pro fighters cannot be compared.
for example you and me aren’t cutting weight and I haven’t since high school wrestling. Fighters are and do regularly. This in itself overtime, can inhibit low testosterone levels. your statistics are apples to oranges bro.
After a botched kick atempt in the AFC championship game vs the Patriots, Ravens kicker Billy Cundiff attempted to commit suicide. Unfortunately, he could'nt kick the chair out from under himself...
by ClinchKing on Jan 29, 2012 8:06 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
I just don't really care about the weight cutting
If the guys that cut the most weight were the top guys in each division then I could see it . But cutting weight is only an advantage to a point .
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by randallhumpfreeze on Jan 29, 2012 2:52 PM EST reply actions
? Aldo a ton of weight
GSP 23lbs,Silva 20/25 lbs,Jones a ton of weight
"ever heard of a tune up? tee hee hee hee
"ah hee hee hee ever heard of a ritual killing? tee hee hee hee"
"i dont get it"
"you gnaw on her face in public like that again and you'll be one tee hee hee hee"
Yah they cut alot but they aren't the biggest guys in their division
I don’t think the weight they cut is why they win , besides jones I don’t see it . Cutting weight isn’t the deciding factor .
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by randallhumpfreeze on Jan 29, 2012 3:36 PM EST up reply actions
I think all the TRT and bullshit should be banned
And I agree with the double weigh ins.
They gotta stop the juice and the dangerous cuts.
Overeem is sexy and he knows it.
wrong it needs to be legalized. If all fighters are in peak shape via TRT and other substances.
Then they’ll come in the case with strenght, power, speed, cardio and whatever attributes help their style. They’ll be injury free and have much easier weight cuts. That means when the competitive advantages are minimized in the physical aspects then guys will be forced to look for them in their skills. That means the technical level of the sport should increase as a whole. And quite frankly thats all i care about. Peak athletic performance and technical mastery which is the core of every sport.
Big Nog for life
Thiago Tavares finally puttin it together!
Head of the Church of Bones Jones.
by NNR (formerly NameNotRequired) on Jan 29, 2012 6:08 PM EST up reply actions
Besides, if you let everyone juice with whatever,
Won’t it come down to who hires the best chemist/doctor to make and shoot the concoctions. I want the athlete to decide the fight
Well the game of the best chemist / concoction is what's currently happening. x
Trying to police it is one of the worst wastes of resources. A money pit in itself and can barely catch anyone worth a damn. With legalizing it you have to realize that there’s definitely a level where the incremental increase in functional athletic ability from increased intake or higher quality concotion intake will have little to zero impact in their fight performance. In fact, at a certain point, their bodies might experience negative effects too which is all the better for their opponent and worse for their fight career. Legalization is truely letting the fighter choose for themselves.
I am a card carrying member of N.A.M.B.LA , I also love and support Jerry Sandusky
by NNR (formerly NameNotRequired) on Jan 29, 2012 9:36 PM EST up reply actions
Where do we draw the line on synthetically changing our bodies for sport?
Metal plates the head, metal studs in the knuckles, being part cyborg. If you can’t compete with what you have naturally, then you can’t compete. Should that gimp kyle Maynard get prosthetics to make him even with normal people, or should we all accept that his natural born body should not be there. Trt is just a loophole, all users are cheating
Everybody is already on steroids nothing can stop it
You are banned from Bloody Elbow.
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Insulting staff and using the word "***" are both completely inappropriate. So long.
by randallhumpfreeze on Jan 29, 2012 8:47 PM EST up reply actions
sad but true
but we have to draw a line in the sand somewhere. its like i know when my kids become teenagers, they will drink, smoke pot/cigs, and fuck, but it doesnt mean i wont fight it at every chance i can get, i wont let them do it as much and as often as they want or i guarantee it will get out of hand.
fuck steroid testing, fuck banned substances.... COMING UP NEXT...........
you should totally twitter that on your facebook
hahaha, i think Brock is proof of that.
I am a card carrying member of N.A.M.B.LA , I also love and support Jerry Sandusky
by NNR (formerly NameNotRequired) on Jan 29, 2012 9:37 PM EST up reply actions
NJSAC already has a double weigh-in rule
"It’s Mark Pavelich calling from the Maximum Fighting Championship,
I’ve just received notice that Drew Fickett or you, I don’t care which one of you fuckers did it, has signed a contract to fight in Strikeforce this fucking weekend. I’m going to get on a fucking plane soon and go where you’re at and choke you the fuck out. I’m telling you right now, I’ve had enough of your fucking shit. First of all, I’ve sent you the fucking pictures and secondly, I placed Drew Fickett in a fight fucking months ago and five weeks prior to my main event of my fucking fight card. You’re going to give me a fucking call tomorrow or I swear I’ll get on a fucking plane and go right where you’re at right now. You’re pissing me off, I’ve been nothing but professional to you motherfuckers and you’re doing this kind of bullshit, alright? Call me back, I’m fucking pissed."
by Swedish Chef smerdy herdy verdy on Feb 1, 2012 2:12 PM EST reply actions
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