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Champion vs Champion: a study in contrasts

On the fateful night of Oct 14, 2006, fans witnessed two of the greatest tragedies in UFC history. First, we saw fan-favorite Rich Franklin’s nose relocated to the side of his head, (where it clearly did not belong) and we haven’t seen his stunning wife Beth at ringside since. And far worse than this, we saw one of MMA’s most noble and gentlemanly champions replaced by the biggest fraud ever to wear gold in the UFC. Bold words? Perhaps, but lets look at the facts.

Star-divide

When Anderson Silva came to the UFC, very few of us had any clue who he was. He was coming off a 1-fight win streak in Cage Rage (that’s right, folks, just one). His debutante ball would be against TUF season1 problem-child, Chris Leben. Silva dispatched Leben with ease, (just as Josh Koscheck and Kenny Florian had done in the TUF house.) This single victory earned Anderson a shot at the world title. Much to the dismay of fans at the time, Silva took champion Rich Franklin apart in brutal fashion, and later did it again in their rematch, leaving no doubt that he was the more gifted fighter. But is he a better Champion? Lets take a closer look at their careers.

Since coming to the UFC, Silva has fought 14 fights and won them all, the longest unbeaten record in UFC history. Under any circumstances that is an impressive feat to be sure. Clearly he’s an exceptionally talented man. Anyone would be crazy to argue otherwise. But lets look at who he’s fought and how he’s behaved, to get a better sense of his Championship spirit. First, lets consider that Anderson Silva is a very large man. At 6’2” and walking around between 220 & 230 lbs (by his own admission and the testimony of many other fighters), he dwarfs most middleweights and has a freakishly long reach. In fact, he normally weighs more than and has a height and reach advantage over half of the UFC’s Lightheavyweights. Yet he has spent almost his whole career fighting in the UFC’s weakest division, and with the exception of the hand-picked Griffin fight, has refused to fight other elite fighters unless they can match his ridiculous weight cutting ability and meet him down at 185, which so far, only Belfort and Hendo have managed to do. Silva has fought four other Championship caliber fighters in his career, Forrest, Hendo, Franklin, and Belfort. Other than Franklin (whom Silva still calls his toughest test), Silva has attempted to avoid these and any other opponents who might pose a threat to his win streak. When Belfort was promised a title shot, Silva and his manager Ed Soares, launched a full-blown publicity campaign claiming that Belfort had not earned the right to fight for the UFC title with only 1 victory since returning the UFC (seemingly forgetting that Anderson had gotten as shot after only 1 win over Leben and coming off only a 1-win streak before that, while Belfort had earned his shot by KOing Rich, the previous MW champion, was on a 5-fight win streak, and was already a former 2-division UFC Champ.) Oddly, Silva seemed to think his own win over Rich made him worthy of a title, but Vitor's didn’t even make him worthy of a shot. Instead he fought Demian Maia who was on a 1-fight win streak after being knocked unconscious in just 21 seconds. Silva made no protests whatever about Maia’s worthiness to get a title shot (though he had protested Marquardt’s claim after said 21sec KO over Maia.) Against Maia, Silva danced around like a buffoon for 3 rounds and then played Kalib Starnes for the last 2, outraging Dana & the fans, making a mockery of the sport and his title, and insulting not only his opponent, but UFC’s new share-holders, the Abu-Dhabi royal family. Silva never expressed any complaints about the worthiness of opponents like Travis Lutter, Thales Leites, or Patrick Cote, but when his toughest test up to that point, Dan Henderson, was promised a rematch after decapitating Michael Bisping (whom Silva was and is calling out as a “worthy challenger”), along with wins over Franklin and Palhares, Silva said Hendo didn’t deserve another shot and should have to fight Marquardt first while the champ took some time off, maybe dabbled in boxing, and put the belt on the shelf. When the UFC was persistent in pursuing the Hendo fight, Silva claimed he had an elbow injury that would require surgery. But a few weeks later when Hendo left the UFC, Silva suddenly announced he was ready to fight had no memory of his alleged injury, “Who could have hurt me?”, and called for a fight against HW Frank Mir, who was coming off back-to-back losses and had just beefed up to 265 lbs, knowing full well that no commission would ever sanction that fight.

Silva is still playing the same old games, claiming that the man who completely dominated him for 4 ½ rounds does not deserve a rematch and should first have to fight Brian Stann (the only MW bigger than Silva) and Mark Munoz (another dangerous grappler Silva wants no part of). Now Sonnen is scheduled to fight Michael Bisping, the guy Silva has been calling out for years to divert attention from real contenders. I wonder what new tactic Silva will come up with to avoid Sonnen after Bisping is dismantled? Calling out a Welterweight again, perhaps? Dana "100% guarantees" that if Sonnen beats Bisping he'll get the next shot at Anderson, but we all know that's not gonna happen. He made the same promise before Sonnen beat Stann, before Belfort beat Franklin, before Marquardt beat Maia, before Hendo beat Bisping. But in our hearts, we know Sonnen is right, that Anderson won't take that fight, that he'll retire before he'll take that fight, or invent more convenient on/off injuries till an easier opponent comes up.

Now in contrast, lets look at Rich Franklin. Obviously Rich’s W/L stats are nowhere near Silva’s. But lets take a look at his championship attitude and fighting spirit. While Silva has been doing his ever-loving best to avoid top MW contenders, Rich has been fighting a Who’s Who of legendary champions in 2 divisions (and everywhere in between). Since coming to the UFC, Franklin has fought ELEVEN matches against Hall of Famers. And while he’s had mixed success, his championship heart cannot be denied. Although smaller than Silva and smaller than most of his opponents, without hesitation Rich has fought guys that Silva flat refused to fight (Machida, Wanderlei) or tried his best to wiggle out of (Hendo, Belfort). And his resume reads like a roll call of legendary champions: Shamrock, Tanner, Machida, Silva, Liddell, Wanderlei, Griffin, Hendo, & Belfort. That’s eleven fights against nine champions with a combined 11 world titles to their names, almost all of them bigger than Rich.

That’s what I call “challenging yourself”, that’s what I call the heart of a true Champion.

Poll
Anderson Silva is:
a cowardly Duck
8 votes
a handpicking Diva
30 votes
a disrespectful Bully
2 votes
ALL OF THE ABOVE
38 votes
I'm waiting for Ed Soares & Dana White to tell me what I think.
33 votes

111 votes | Poll has closed

Comment 135 comments  |  Add comment  |  7 recs  | 

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longest troll post ever?

you should totally twitter that on your facebook

by ~Peregrine on Jan 22, 2012 10:06 AM EST reply actions  

ive recd the shit out of it!

"ever heard of a tune up? tee hee hee hee
"ah hee hee hee ever heard of a ritual killing? tee hee hee hee"
"i dont get it"
"you gnaw on her face in public like that again and you'll be one tee hee hee hee"

by scott1 on Jan 22, 2012 10:18 AM EST up reply actions  

I believe you've got a typo there, Peregrine.

Longest TRUE post ever. True is spelled T-R-U-E, not t-r-o-l-l. It’s okay, man, you’re from Canada….brain freeze, mice in your beer, stray hockey pucks to the noggin…We’ve seen the McKenzie brothers, we understand. We feel your pain.

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 22, 2012 10:36 AM EST up reply actions  

…plus you’re named after a hobbit…I’m sure that made for a rough childhood.

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 22, 2012 10:38 AM EST up reply actions  

(see Lord of the Rings: Peregrine Took aka “Pippin”, cousin of Frodo). I know there’s also a falcon by that name, but that’s not nearly as fun as calling someone a half-sized, hairy-footed hole-dweller.

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 22, 2012 12:20 PM EST up reply actions  

you guys are so funny

oh so funny

you should totally twitter that on your facebook

by ~Peregrine on Jan 22, 2012 1:18 PM EST up reply actions  

Tl;dr Version.

’I’m mad Anderson isn’t fighting at 205, because of this, he isn’t a great champion. Despite winning every fight and humiliating the best competition, it doesn’t matter. Anderson has never fought at 205, ever. It’s not like he hasn’t beat a former champion in Forrest at 205. Unlike GSP, he hasn’t fought a weight division up.’

Bobby Southworth

by danago on Jan 22, 2012 10:50 AM EST via mobile reply actions  

‘Franklin is the better champion despite the fact that Anderson brutalized him twice, and has achieved more as champion. He’s ducking Chael, the guy he beat and faking an injury. It’s not even like the UFC check their fighters with their Doctors’.

Bobby Southworth

by danago on Jan 22, 2012 10:53 AM EST via mobile up reply actions  

are you Okay, Bro?

sounds like you missed your morning dose of Ed & Dana’s kool-aid!

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 22, 2012 11:01 AM EST up reply actions  

I don't know why you Hate on Dana and the UFC so much

They’ve done more good for the sport than ill, and that should be well remembered. I enjoy watching DREAM events, Pro Elite, Strikeforce(prior to the Zuffa purchase, still enjoy it now), Shark Fights, ect. But the elite of the world fight in the UFC. And bashing the people who help make that possible doesn’t lend well to you credibility as an objective source.

"I am the tomato can that crushed your champion, live with it."

by wolfman13 on Jan 22, 2012 11:07 AM EST up reply actions  

Oh, I don’t hate Dana and the UFC at all. I LOVE them! But I do fault Dana for 2 things:

1) constantly blowing smoke up our ass with hyperbole and empty promises.

2) Letting Ed Soares dictate Anderson’s matchmaking on more than one occasion, to the point even of letting Hendo leave the UFC rather than giving him a promised title shot. (Dana made out like it was all about the money for Hendo, but the money didn’t come up till it was clear to Hendo that he wasn’t getting his rematch and he basically said, either give me a shot at the champ, or pay me like one.)

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 22, 2012 11:16 AM EST up reply actions  

Dana is a promoter

They are always full of shit. They have to get the masses interested. If they fail to do so then they won’t be a promoter very long.

Soares job is to make sure his client gets the fights he wants. Should he have actual control? No, not at all. I think a rematch with Hendo is long overdue for Silva. But that’s a personal opinion.

"I am the tomato can that crushed your champion, live with it."

by wolfman13 on Jan 22, 2012 11:24 AM EST up reply actions  

and yes, Franklin is more of a champion. Clearly Silva is a better fighter, but Rich has the heart of a champion. Andy has the heart of a Casino owner…he doesn’t put his chips on the table unless he knows the odds are stacked overwhelmingly in his favor.

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 22, 2012 11:05 AM EST up reply actions  

It’s not “moving up” if you weigh 230 and only cut to 205 instead of 185…it’s called being a little less of a coward. And Forrest was hand-picked to make Silva look good after he was booed out of the arena in his previous two fights. Forrest is a stand-n-banger with no KO power and half Silva’s speed. Stylistically it was a “gimme” match for Silva and Forrest made it clear before the fight that he knew he was being sacrificed on the alter of Dana’s pet spider.

Four of GSP’s last six opponents have had a significant size advantage over him. He doesn’t have to “move up”, he’s already fighting bigger guys than himself. Silva has only fought 1 guy bigger than him, and a lot of guys were 20-30 lbs smaller.

And how can you say “humiliating the best competition” when Silva won’t even go near the best competition and has spent his whole career beating up the UFC’s weakest division.

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 22, 2012 11:00 AM EST up reply actions  

Tl:dr that and I might read it.

Anderson has fought and beaten everyone the UFC have put infront of him. That’s the bottom line, Rich Frankin sucks in comparison. Bye

Bobby Southworth

by danago on Jan 22, 2012 11:10 AM EST via mobile up reply actions  

No, he’s beaten everyone he’s step up in front of, not everyone they’ve tried to put in front of him.

Please explain “Tl:dr”…what language is that?

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 22, 2012 11:17 AM EST up reply actions  

Who are these fighters he’s ducked in the UFC?

Bobby Southworth

by danago on Jan 22, 2012 11:19 AM EST via mobile up reply actions  

And how is Rich even the greater champion? He fought Vitor, the same person Anderdon humiliated, and got KTFO. He fought Forrest, the same person Anderson embarrassed, and got beat. And if you think Franklins run was more impressive than Anderson you need your meda kid. Add to that Anderson brutalized Rich, what points are you trying to make here?

Anderson even beat Chael, who is considered amongst the best wrestlers in MMA and beat him. He has fought everyone, and beaten them.

Bobby Southworth

by danago on Jan 22, 2012 11:15 AM EST via mobile up reply actions  

He even beat Hendo, did Frankin? LOL

Bobby Southworth

by danago on Jan 22, 2012 11:18 AM EST via mobile up reply actions  

again, dumbass, I said, “Champion” not “better fighter”. I have clearly and repeatedly acknowledged that Anderson is a better fighter than Rich. Being a true “champion” means more than just beating people up. I’m not comparing Rich’s reign with the belt to Silva’s, I’m comparing the character & heart that they’ve shown in the way they bear themselves. Rich acts like a Champion. Silva acts like a ducking diva bitch.

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 22, 2012 11:21 AM EST up reply actions  

Getting beat up doesn’t make you a better champion. Anderson has beaten all the opponents who have beaten Rich as of late, with ease.

Bobby Southworth

by danago on Jan 22, 2012 11:29 AM EST via mobile up reply actions  

still missing the point…

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 22, 2012 11:30 AM EST up reply actions  

I see your points

but it’s only one perspective. You raise some questions I hadn’t thought about previously.

However, his legacy won’t be denied as one of the best fighters of his generation. He has shown dominance in the last 6 years that’s unmatched by anyone in MMA today. That’s a fact, simple cold hard truth.

Personally, as a fan and not as someone who tries to remain impartial. I can’t remember the last time I was rooting for him in a fight. I don’t watch his fights to see him win in devastating fashion(though I am still impressed when he does it ), I watch his fights to see him lose. I was rooting for Maia, Okami, Henderson, Belfort. Hell if Rashad Evans ever moved down to middleweight I would cheer for him against him.

"I am the tomato can that crushed your champion, live with it."

by wolfman13 on Jan 22, 2012 11:03 AM EST reply actions   1 recs

you know, I might too….and I HATE Rashad!

I have some of the same beef with Bones that I have with Silva, about not fighting guys his own size, but at least Bones is fighting the most talented guys in the world, not a 2nd rate division. I still wish he’d man up and move to HW (he’s bigger than JDS) but I think biology won’t give him a choice much longer. He’s said himself that he’s still growing and he doesn’t think the weight cut will be possible much longer.

But Silva’s attempts to tell the UFC who should have to fight who before they fight him are just unprecedented and he’s got a laundry list of guys he refuses to fight because he says they’re his friends, (though several of them have said they’d fight him). Add that to his disrespectful behavior and the way he clowns on guys like Forrest and Maia and I just can’t stomach him as a champion. He may well be the most talented guy to ever step in the cage, but I’m not gonna give him that title until he proves it against the stack of legends his own size at 205.

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 22, 2012 11:11 AM EST up reply actions  

thats one thing i cant understand

most guys on here are putting way too big a gap between Bones an Silva on the mythical p4p list.Some even have Silva 1 and Bones 3! WTF! The LHW div is WAY more talented than the MW div and Bones is decimating his opponents.I too see an “injury” in the future f Sonnen wins.

"ever heard of a tune up? tee hee hee hee
"ah hee hee hee ever heard of a ritual killing? tee hee hee hee"
"i dont get it"
"you gnaw on her face in public like that again and you'll be one tee hee hee hee"

by scott1 on Jan 22, 2012 11:16 AM EST up reply actions  

He does make you wonder

how many injuries can one sustain. He is in his late 30’s, but I don’t remember Randy Couture or even Hendo having these problems with injures, constant I mean….

"I am the tomato can that crushed your champion, live with it."

by wolfman13 on Jan 22, 2012 11:25 AM EST up reply actions  

YOU CANT FAKE INJURIES IN THE UFCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCC. holy shit how many times are people gonna say this?

by AzCombat on Jan 24, 2012 5:30 PM EST up reply actions  

You can't?

haha

Overeem is sexy and he knows it.

by jay. on Jan 24, 2012 5:53 PM EST up reply actions  

Have you ever been to a doctor?

Dana always feeds us this BS line, saying that fighters have to see a UFC doctor. But if you’ve ever been to a doctor you know that 90% of their “diagnosis” is based on what you tell them. ie: “Where does it hurt?” “Does it hurt when I do this?” All you need to do is say “Ouch” and they’ll say, “Oh, looks like you have some soft tissue damage and need to let that rest for a while.”

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 25, 2012 12:23 AM EST up reply actions  

Oh the things that are disrespectful to opponents is why I'm not a huge fan of Silva

I just recognize how good is he. Does it appear he avoids some fights? Yeah, it’s possible. I’m not denying that.

Jon Jones will eventually move up to heavyweight I believe and hope, I think he will get tested there by the bigger fighters.
Silva doesn’t have the same size advantage Jones appears to have during fight time, I think your opinion might be a little off on that.

"I am the tomato can that crushed your champion, live with it."

by wolfman13 on Jan 22, 2012 11:22 AM EST up reply actions  

Not quite as much, but he is huge for a MW. He’s had some guys closer to his size that came down from LHW or somewhere in between (Franklin, Hendo, Belfort). But most of his opponents have been significantly smaller. When he fought at 205, Silva looked every bit as big as Irvin and almost as big as Forrest, who was the largest guy in the division until Bones came along.

But you’re right, I think Bones has a bigger size advantage over most of his opponents than Silva had. But in his first 3 title fights, Bones has already destroyed more talent than Silva has faced in his whole 5 year reign.

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 22, 2012 11:28 AM EST up reply actions  

he is huge for a MW

Griffin went into the cage post fight at a HW match once in Cage Rage and he was bigger than the pair of them.Silva was comparable in size as Griffin so that puts it into perspective and i dont doubt for one minute that Bones will go to HW,hes got the balls and wants to test himself.Great fighters dont stay in the comfort zone imo.

"ever heard of a tune up? tee hee hee hee
"ah hee hee hee ever heard of a ritual killing? tee hee hee hee"
"i dont get it"
"you gnaw on her face in public like that again and you'll be one tee hee hee hee"

by scott1 on Jan 22, 2012 11:31 AM EST up reply actions  

He isn’t nearly as big as what Jones is at 205. Jones literally makes him opponents look SMALL.

Bobby Southworth

by danago on Jan 22, 2012 11:34 AM EST via mobile up reply actions  

Nice job shonuff

Agree with you on most points, but some of the arguments you made just have an overwhelming amount of facts and evidence going against it.

Also Silva is a disgrace to MMA fans everywhere, proof.

Queer.

Show no mercy; for you shall receive none

by Chorongota on Jan 22, 2012 12:06 PM EST reply actions  

Total fag.

"We mortals are but shadows and dust..."

Arlovski : Kang : GSP : Rampage : Lytle : Huerta : Stout: Quarry : Serra : Pulver : Alvarez : Lombard

(¯`i´¯)´·¸.)‹^›

by ArlovsKang on Jan 22, 2012 12:22 PM EST up reply actions  

Don't laugh!

If Sonnen beats Bisping, this is who Anderson is planning on calling out next! You can see “The Beeb” is already practicing his MMA moves, like the Rashadian Sack Grab!

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 22, 2012 12:23 PM EST up reply actions  

Very thought provoking this piece shonuff.

With a touch of finely selected incendiary words, I love it.

A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. - Herm Albright

by Yan117 on Jan 22, 2012 2:42 PM EST reply actions  

finely selected, gently marinated, and seasoned to perfection! I call it Spider Flambe’.

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 22, 2012 9:17 PM EST up reply actions  

P4P GAYEST Post ever!!!!!!!!!

What happened shonuff? Did silva notice your adams apple when you were cross dressing and trying to pick him up? The hate has blinded you.

Chubby chasin johnson fan. I foolishly picked an unproven middleweight over belfort. And now i'm stuck with this sig for 2 weeks.

by goldmouth on Jan 22, 2012 11:20 PM EST reply actions  

He didn’t notice me at all cause he was too distracted by you giving him a lap dance dressed up in your Village People costume singing Justin Bieber karaoke!

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 23, 2012 12:20 AM EST up reply actions  

Oh, and I’m not the one with blinders on…you are, you and all your Ed Soares kool-aid drinkin’ cohorts.

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 23, 2012 12:21 AM EST up reply actions  

Nope, can’t stand Leben, and I didn’t start hatin’ on Silva till he started clowning on chumps and trying to duck every legit Top 3 that they tried to match him with, also when I heard him & other fighters say that he walks around between 220-230 lbs …and yet was calling out GSP while refusing to fight Shogun or Machida. That’s when I lost all respect for him…guess it was around 2009.

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 23, 2012 12:11 AM EST up reply actions  

How the fuck did he duck anyone ? You rancid sack of dead turtles

I agree Anderson should have moved up to 205 though

You are banned from Bloody Elbow.
You can browse the blog, but you can't participate.

Insulting staff and using the word "***" are both completely inappropriate. So long.

by randallhumpfreeze on Jan 23, 2012 2:11 AM EST up reply actions  

don't ask me, ask Hendo, ask Nate, ask Belfort, ask Sonnen.

He tried his damnedest to wiggle out of all those fights.

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 23, 2012 8:04 AM EST up reply actions  

He beat them all kid.

Bobby Southworth

by danago on Jan 23, 2012 8:57 AM EST up reply actions  

I never said he couldn’t beat them, I said he tried to duck them. He is still trying to duck a rematch with Sonnen or Hendo.

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 23, 2012 9:35 AM EST up reply actions  

No kid, he did beat them. It’s not a matter of him ducking them, he actually fought those guys and smashed them.

Bobby Southworth

by danago on Jan 23, 2012 9:45 AM EST up reply actions  

AFTER ducking them.

That’s like starting to pay child support when your kid turns 14, then acting like you’re father of the year.

Overeem is sexy and he knows it.

by jay. on Jan 23, 2012 11:52 AM EST up reply actions  

He should have given Sonnen a rematch already.

Good metaphor brother jay.

A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. - Herm Albright

by Yan117 on Jan 23, 2012 8:08 PM EST up reply actions  

+100

brilliant analogy, Jay. And in Silva’s case it’s like hiring Johnny Cochran to claim that the kids aren’t yours, then to appeal their worthiness to receive support, and then only after years of legal proceedings, two paternity tests, and a court-order threatening to garnish your wages, and an appearance on Maury Povich…THEN you pay the child support and claim to be father of the year.

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 23, 2012 8:18 PM EST up reply actions  

i love the ducking argument

Even though you can’t name 1 fighter that he has ducked. Saying he won’t move up to fight jones does not equal ducking. He’s fought andbeat everyone in his weight class. You just got sand in your twat cuz you wanna see him lose. Hate away bro. Thats what haters do.

Chubby chasin johnson fan. I foolishly picked an unproven middleweight over belfort. And now i'm stuck with this sig for 2 weeks.

by goldmouth on Jan 23, 2012 7:49 AM EST up reply actions  

If you weigh 230 lbs and all the top guys in the world the worthiest challenges are about your size and fighting at 205, but instead YOU cut down to 185 to avoid all those guys…you’re ducking! You’re going out of your way and putting yourself through a lot of extra strain just to avoid fighting top guys your own size. It’s not “moving up” if its still 20 lbs below your normal weight, it’s just cutting less. Anderson has spent his whole career AVOIDING top competition, not seeking it out. He has tried to run from every major challenge. He won’t even fight guys his own size, let alone bigger. He can do amazing things, but he won’t even play unless the deck is clearly stacked in his favor. He’s a coward, plain and simple.

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 23, 2012 8:11 AM EST up reply actions  

Why doesn't he move up since he cleared out his division 4 years ago?

People are crying that GSP won’t move up to fight a 230 pounder, but Anderson goes untouched in the worst division in the sport.

Overeem is sexy and he knows it.

by jay. on Jan 23, 2012 11:53 AM EST up reply actions  

+1 on jay's comment

a fine fanpost, shonuff

pride never die.

by vhw_ on Jan 23, 2012 4:40 PM EST up reply actions  

All i have to say is that Rich would never beat JBJ.

Therefore this post should be about how awesome Bones Jones is.

Big Nog for life
Thiago Tavares finally puttin it together!
Head of the Church of Bones Jones.

by NNR (formerly NameNotRequired) on Jan 23, 2012 10:23 AM EST via mobile reply actions  

Couldn't agree more, Sho.

AS is a ducker and everybody knows it.

Overeem is sexy and he knows it.

by jay. on Jan 23, 2012 11:54 AM EST reply actions  

He has ducked fighting at 205. Then again, if you want to roast Andy for fighting in a weight class lower than his natural weight...then get your flame thrower ready for every fighter except maybe Frankie Edgar. Sho has always hated Andy but I do admit

…this is his best fanpost in quite some time.

"To thine own self be true, and it must follow, as the night the day, thou canst not then be false to any man." - William Shakespeare (Hamlet, Act 1, Scene 3)

by OJR on Jan 23, 2012 12:17 PM EST up reply actions  

I think GSP is in his natural weight class as well

I went 0-2 against Phasebook. Why do I feel that I am just padding his record?" Next time I won’t pick a guy whose best weapon is a somersault against a real bad guy like Scarface.
Check out what I've been drinking lately

by ShivanTiger on Jan 23, 2012 12:54 PM EST up reply actions  

I thought he walked around at 185 - 190?

"To thine own self be true, and it must follow, as the night the day, thou canst not then be false to any man." - William Shakespeare (Hamlet, Act 1, Scene 3)

by OJR on Jan 23, 2012 1:36 PM EST up reply actions  

I'm just talking about body mass and overall build

yes he cuts weight, but I think most people would agree, he is probably to small to be a 185 lb fighter.

I went 0-2 against Phasebook. Why do I feel that I am just padding his record?" Next time I won’t pick a guy whose best weapon is a somersault against a real bad guy like Scarface.
Check out what I've been drinking lately

by ShivanTiger on Jan 23, 2012 1:42 PM EST up reply actions  

he's got the talent to cover that up

but his wrestling won’t be as imposing, i’m afraid

pride never die.

by vhw_ on Jan 23, 2012 4:44 PM EST up reply actions  

15 or 20 pound cut

AS said himself he weighs over 220 when not fighting.

35 pound cut

Overeem is sexy and he knows it.

by jay. on Jan 23, 2012 1:42 PM EST up reply actions  

Ok, so I am right. Edgar is the only exception to the rule.

"To thine own self be true, and it must follow, as the night the day, thou canst not then be false to any man." - William Shakespeare (Hamlet, Act 1, Scene 3)

by OJR on Jan 23, 2012 2:10 PM EST up reply actions  

BJ fought his last 2 fights at his natural weight

He just hasn’t been doing well :(

Politics is just one big ass blast.

by Rolandando on Jan 23, 2012 2:20 PM EST up reply actions  

Haha! He usedf to cut to 155 so he won't get a pass. He is still a warrior, though - despite his bratty attitude.

"To thine own self be true, and it must follow, as the night the day, thou canst not then be false to any man." - William Shakespeare (Hamlet, Act 1, Scene 3)

by OJR on Jan 23, 2012 2:39 PM EST up reply actions  

Junior Dos Santos doesn't cut

Give the man his respect.

Overeem is sexy and he knows it.

by jay. on Jan 23, 2012 6:14 PM EST up reply actions  

He can cut to 205? That's very surprising to me.

"To thine own self be true, and it must follow, as the night the day, thou canst not then be false to any man." - William Shakespeare (Hamlet, Act 1, Scene 3)

by OJR on Jan 23, 2012 6:23 PM EST up reply actions  

You said Edgar doesn't cut

Neither does JDS and he fights guys that outweigh him sometimes by up to 45 pounds at fight time.

I doubt JDS can cut to 205, maybe though. Ask him.

Overeem is sexy and he knows it.

by jay. on Jan 24, 2012 11:43 AM EST up reply actions  

Yeah his hands with the power and speed would be a force

I don't try to intimidate anybody before a fight. That's nonsense. I intimidate people by hitting them.

by Puck Head on Jan 24, 2012 1:21 PM EST up reply actions  

jds to 205?

why do you want all light heavies to die? its just not right man, not right at all

Chael sonnen is a God

by OlsonRy on Jan 25, 2012 5:27 PM EST up reply actions  

the Lightheavies are already dying

Behold, the apocalypse is already upon them! Hast thou not heard tell of the coming of young Jones?

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 25, 2012 8:45 PM EST up reply actions  

Part of the reason I respect Frankie Edgar so damn much.

He’s more than just brave for always fighting bigger and stronger opponents. He’s very smart. The no-weight-cutting strategy he uses benefits his speed and cardio massively. And it shows spectacularly. He will outspeed and outlast anyone at 155, including Aldo. Would he survive getting rocked by Aldo? Who knows.

A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. - Herm Albright

by Yan117 on Jan 23, 2012 8:19 PM EST up reply actions  

Frankie rocks! Heart of a lion!

Imagine what he could do with Andy’s skills!

Recipe for the perfect fighter:
Andy’s timing
Bones’ reach
GSP’s transitions
Hendo’s chin
Randy’s brain
Frankie’s heart

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 23, 2012 8:26 PM EST up reply actions  

You clearly don't know shit.

He doesn’t cut 35 pounds. When NOT training he weighs 220. His training camp weight is 195, he only cuts around 10 pounds. He easily makes 185. Get a clue kid.

by MMA Boss on Jan 23, 2012 10:00 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

Hey Fag

Don’t be mad at me. ANDERSON FUCKING SILVA SAID HE WEIGHS OVER 220 BEFORE A FIGHT. I DIDN’T MAKE IT UP. WATCH HIS VLOGS AND STOP ACTING LIKE A KNOW-IT-ALL.

Overeem is sexy and he knows it.

by jay. on Jan 24, 2012 11:44 AM EST up reply actions  

Are you suggesting AS cuts 25 pounds BEFORE a training camp starts so he only has to cut 10 pounds during a camp?

You’re fucking retarded if you think any of that is true.

Overeem is sexy and he knows it.

by jay. on Jan 24, 2012 11:45 AM EST up reply actions  

Plus

You didn’t even disagree with me. You know he weighs over 220 when not fighting. You know he weighs 185 the day before a fight. You know there’s 35 pound difference between the two. Can you explain what it is you disagree with? I didn’t say he cuts 35 pounds the night before weigh-ins, stupid.

Overeem is sexy and he knows it.

by jay. on Jan 24, 2012 11:51 AM EST up reply actions  

MMA Boss you must not of been around long

Silva is one of the biggest MW’s that is around 210-215 on fight night as you can go back and search on mania where there is proof of this and that = 3- to 35 pounds. Silva also has walked around before training over 230lbs.

I believe the average MW is around 200-205 and Silva typically has a 10 pound advantage on any MW fighter.

I don't try to intimidate anybody before a fight. That's nonsense. I intimidate people by hitting them.

by Puck Head on Jan 24, 2012 11:52 AM EST up reply actions  

Guys in the WW division like Alves and Fitch on fight night are 200lbs

I don't try to intimidate anybody before a fight. That's nonsense. I intimidate people by hitting them.

by Puck Head on Jan 24, 2012 11:54 AM EST up reply actions  

alves i buy it

fitch, nah man. He barely cuts any weight since switching to a vegan life. Here’s hoping he goes back to a normal diet ’cause he seems to be missing some strenght

pride never die.

by vhw_ on Jan 24, 2012 3:58 PM EST up reply actions  

Someone should post an analysis of all Silva's losses

We can learn much more about a fighter by looking at his losses (and near-losses), because they expose his weaknesses- mental, and physical.

by Motmaitre on Jan 23, 2012 3:20 PM EST reply actions  

Do it!

"To thine own self be true, and it must follow, as the night the day, thou canst not then be false to any man." - William Shakespeare (Hamlet, Act 1, Scene 3)

by OJR on Jan 23, 2012 3:31 PM EST up reply actions  

Sonnen has it but can't defend subs.

"To thine own self be true, and it must follow, as the night the day, thou canst not then be false to any man." - William Shakespeare (Hamlet, Act 1, Scene 3)

by OJR on Jan 23, 2012 6:23 PM EST up reply actions  

I'm sure defending the triangle is something WWE Sonnen can eventually get his clownish brain around of.

A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. - Herm Albright

by Yan117 on Jan 23, 2012 8:23 PM EST up reply actions  

If that was true then he would have dethroned Andy.

"To thine own self be true, and it must follow, as the night the day, thou canst not then be false to any man." - William Shakespeare (Hamlet, Act 1, Scene 3)

by OJR on Jan 24, 2012 9:09 AM EST up reply actions  

Silva's actual losses are so long ago they're no longer relevant.

But then, I suspect that was your point and you meant that in sarcasm.

However, we can learn a lot about his weaknesses from the Sonnen fight.

IMO, Silva’s biggest asset BY FAR is his impecable timing…his ability to instinctively measure an opponent’s range, timing, and habits and know what they’re going to do and how they’re going to move before they know themselves. It functions very much like Jedi foresight, but there’s nothing supernatural about it. He simply has an amazing ability to subconsciously perceive patterns in his opponents movements and instinctively predict and respond to them. I doubt it’s ever even going through his conscious mind, he just feels it. People think he’s really fast, but that’s not it. Both his speed and his precision come from sensing what the opponent is about to do before the opponent starts to do it. This is what makes him look like Neo in the Matrix. Have you ever seen Silva’s imitation of other fighters’ styles. It’s uncanny. Turn off the audio and you’ll still know exactly who he’s doing in each impersonation. That comes from the same place, that subconsious perceptiveness of all the minute details and patterns in his opponents’ movements.

People think I hate Silva for his skills, or that I hate him for his success or hate him because he beat up fighters that I like or whatever. Not true. I hate him because he may very likely be the single most gifted fighter in the history of MMA and yet he behaves like a diva and a coward, avoiding anyone who might present a real challenge to him, showing blatant disregard for the fans, his opponents, and the honor of the belt he wears.

Bones fought 3 of the sports’ biggest legends in his first year as champion. GSP has fought bigger guys, faster guys, “better wrestlers”, better strikers, everybody they could throw at him even champions from divisions above and below him…with never a single complaint. And we don’t even need to mention Frankie’s heart. In the whole history of the UFC I’ve only ever heard one other fighter besides Silva try to avoid a top challenger and that was when Tito was ducking Chuck, claiming they were friends. Silva has gone WAY WAY WAY beyond that, listing half of Brazil as his “friends” and claiming every Top3 ranked guy was unworthy of a title shot, and then acting like a total jackass. The way he disrespected Maia was unforgivable. I was never a Maia fan till that night. Maia got the shit kicked out of him and just kept coming forward till the final bell, while Andy acted like a jackass for 3 rounds and then rode out the clock and ran away from Maia for the last 10 minutes. Total disgrace! And then he had the arrogance to say that the reason he clowned on Maia was that Maia disrespected him by claiming to have better BJJ. Maia is like a 5 time WORLD BJJ champion! Silva is so full of shit! If he wanted to prove Maia wrong, why did he spend 25 minutes at arms reach (or further) instead of taking Maia to the ground? I’m not recommending that as a wise fight strategy, just saying that if Silva is so arrogant that he gets insulted if a world champion claims to have better jitz, why didn’t he try to prove him wrong? Answer, because his cowardice exceeds even his arrogance!

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 23, 2012 8:53 PM EST up reply actions   2 recs

Quality post.

"To thine own self be true, and it must follow, as the night the day, thou canst not then be false to any man." - William Shakespeare (Hamlet, Act 1, Scene 3)

by OJR on Jan 24, 2012 9:10 AM EST up reply actions  

Ha, I forgot to finish my though. ..never got to the part about his "weakness"

I wouldn’t call it a weakness so much as a blueprint to beat him. What Sonnen exposed was that the way to beat him is to come straight at him. The mistake that almost all of his opponents made was being intimidated by him and trying to feel him out. Problem with that is, before you can feel him out, he’ll have read you like an open book and mastered your timing. The trick is to say, “Screw it!” and go right after him and keep constant relentless and multifaceted pressure on him so he never has a single second to study you and get a feel for your timing and rhythm. Sonnen didn’t beat the shit out of him because he had skills that none of Silva’s other opponents had, he did it because he had no fear of Silva and took the fight right to him from the opening bell. Silva was never able to figure out where Sonnen was coming from or what he was going to do next. And lets be real, Silva didn’t win that fight, Sonnen lost it. He thought Silva had checked out and was just riding out the clock and accepting his defeat and he got sloppy and handed Silva that armbar on a silver platter.

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 24, 2012 4:42 PM EST up reply actions  

Good stuff until the last part. Sonnen has been susceptible to subs - his record is proof of that. Andy won despite being dominated. The heart of a champion beats inside that diva's chest.

"To thine own self be true, and it must follow, as the night the day, thou canst not then be false to any man." - William Shakespeare (Hamlet, Act 1, Scene 3)

by OJR on Jan 24, 2012 5:36 PM EST up reply actions  

Basically what I'm saying is Andy is Spiderman and Chael is Venom

Sonnen found a way around Silva’s “Spider-sense”. Unfortunately, I don’t think he’ll find a way around Ed Soares to ever get his rematch.

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 25, 2012 12:54 AM EST up reply actions  

to be honest, I'm still not certain Chael didn't intentionally throw that fight to avoid being stripped of the belt.

If you watch the tape closely, you can see that Chael keeps leaving that arm laying there on Silva’s chest, then you see Chael saying something to Silva and Silva looking puzzled, then you see Silva throw up the armbar/triangle. It’s almost like Chael told him to do it. From a career-move standpoint it would make perfect sense. If you know you’re going to fail your urine test and Kiser looked pissed when you told him about it…you want to prove to everyone that you can beat Silva, but then not actually win the fight, because then you’d be stripped of the belt and banned from the UFC forever like Josh Barnett was. Dana wouldn’t forgive you for embarrassing the company by having their champion stripped of the belt, but if you lose after a dominant performance, you know you’ll get another shot..

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 25, 2012 12:59 AM EST up reply actions  

I like conspiracy theories and I have a few myself (involving Kimbo Slice taking very little damage against the heavy hands of Roy Nelson) but this one is a bit too far fetched, Sho.

"To thine own self be true, and it must follow, as the night the day, thou canst not then be false to any man." - William Shakespeare (Hamlet, Act 1, Scene 3)

by OJR on Jan 25, 2012 10:16 AM EST up reply actions  

i think that was roy being a nice guy

no point in fucking up nelson and risking a hand injury when he could easily advance to the semi finals

pride never die.

by vhw_ on Jan 25, 2012 12:24 PM EST up reply actions  

Maybe. I see it more like DW telling Roy to not hurt the golden goose for his ratings so Kimbo can "fight" again. Like I said - its my tinfoil hat POV.

"To thine own self be true, and it must follow, as the night the day, thou canst not then be false to any man." - William Shakespeare (Hamlet, Act 1, Scene 3)

by OJR on Jan 25, 2012 1:02 PM EST up reply actions  

I’m with vhw on this one. I think Dana would LOVE to see a KO and shut all the Kimbonites up forever. But Roy said in an interview that he just wanted to sustain as little damage as possible in the first 2 rounds so he could be in the best shape possible for the finale. If I remember right, Roy really pissed Dana off by putting both his earlier opponents in a very boring crucifix that Dana “wasn’t at all impressed” with.

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 25, 2012 4:27 PM EST up reply actions  

The same Kimbonites who happen to boost TUF's ratings because they are sheep who don't know real MMA from street fighting fat guys in parking lots? Naw, I ain't buying it. My tinfoil hat is staying put for this one.

"To thine own self be true, and it must follow, as the night the day, thou canst not then be false to any man." - William Shakespeare (Hamlet, Act 1, Scene 3)

by OJR on Jan 25, 2012 4:45 PM EST up reply actions  

truth

Overeem is sexy and he knows it.

by jay. on Jan 24, 2012 11:49 AM EST up reply actions  

I wouldn’t say that just because he hasn’t lost in a while that his losses are irrelevant. As we discussed in the post about Guillard closing his skill gaps, a fighter’s basic architecture is very hard to change. The same weaknesses Silva had 10 years ago he still has now, including:

-A weak left hand (obvious from his boxing days, still obvious now).
-Relatively weak wrestling and clinching, though his submission grappling and presence of mind when grounded is superb.
-Suspect submission defenses (accounting for two losses), though I would agree that this has improved.

by Motmaitre on Jan 24, 2012 4:44 PM EST up reply actions  

I don’t think the Chonan fight is an indication of weak submission defense. When I guy throws something nobody’s ever tried before and times it perfectly, you can’t call it weak defense if a guy gets caught by it. That’s like saying Belfort has weak striking defense because Andy caught him with that “Steven Segall” kick.

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 24, 2012 5:06 PM EST up reply actions  

I wasn’t actually even thinking of Sonnen. The beating he received from Sonnen I would cite as an example of his weak wrestling and clinching. Re weak submission defence, I was actually looking at his two losses to Ryo Chonen and Daiju Takase, who both defeated Silva by submission.

by Motmaitre on Jan 24, 2012 5:36 PM EST up reply actions  

Anything that happened in Japan counts for nothing

The odds Silva was getting warranted a fixed fight.

Overeem is sexy and he knows it.

by jay. on Jan 24, 2012 5:59 PM EST up reply actions  

not in those old ass fights

i seriously doubt odds were better than even, if anything.

he only became famous after pride

pride never die.

by vhw_ on Jan 24, 2012 6:07 PM EST up reply actions  

Silva had won like 8 in a row

This Takais guy had lost 7 of his last 10.

You really don’t think AS was the betting favorite?

Overeem is sexy and he knows it.

by jay. on Jan 24, 2012 8:53 PM EST up reply actions  

I'd look for the line

But I don’t think you need proof.

Overeem is sexy and he knows it.

by jay. on Jan 24, 2012 8:53 PM EST up reply actions  

This is just coming off as an anti-Anderson Silva Rant

You can say he tries to duck fighters/fights all day, but in the end, he fights whoever they give him and usually destroys them in the process.

It doesn’t help the argument that all the fighters he is ducking are fighters he has already beaten.

It’s not fair to say he’s ducking 205….It’s not his weight class. Sure, he could challenge himself with bigger guys, but it’s not ducking if he doesn’t.

by otherdarkmeat on Jan 23, 2012 3:33 PM EST reply actions  

This was likely written in response to 'Anderson Silva's Resume of Finishes'

which completely came off as a glorified Anderson Silva nuthugging post. You can’t just write ‘good’ or ‘bad’ about someone under the microscope. Well, you can, but it’s just gonna get trolled and not taken seriously by most.

by pdibby on Jan 23, 2012 6:15 PM EST up reply actions  

If you took this post

and the other one by 420mike (Anderson Silva’s Resume of Finishes) and added them together, you’d have one damn accurate assessment of Anderson Silva. He’s great, but he’s also a diva.

by pdibby on Jan 23, 2012 6:03 PM EST reply actions  

Shonuff is the biggest troll.

What loser hates the best fighter ever so much that they would take the time to write all this bullshit. Silva’s training.camp weight is only 195 you.jackass, he only.cuts around 10 pounds the week of the fight. Every.fighter cuts weight. They have weight classes for a reason, if you can make the weight you can fight there. Silva easily makes 185.

I would bet money shonuff and conan the barbarian are the same person.

by MMA Boss on Jan 23, 2012 9:58 PM EST via mobile reply actions  

a steaming chunk of troll shit

You are banned from Bloody Elbow.
You can browse the blog, but you can't participate.

Insulting staff and using the word "***" are both completely inappropriate. So long.

by randallhumpfreeze on Jan 23, 2012 11:29 PM EST up reply actions  

Ju keep jusing dat word, I do not think it means what ju think it means!

A troll is someone who says things they don’t really believe just to get a response out of people. I’ve been on this site for years, long before it came to SBNation, and you can ask any of the long-timers and they’ll tell you that I’m no troll. I may say controversial things, but I not only believe them, I back them up with reason and facts. Now, you may not like the fact that your idol is a ducking diva coward, but facts are still facts…and if you could manage to dislodge your head from your sphincter for a few minutes, you’d be able to see the plain truth in the facts I listed above.

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 24, 2012 1:26 AM EST up reply actions  

Sho is not a troll.

"To thine own self be true, and it must follow, as the night the day, thou canst not then be false to any man." - William Shakespeare (Hamlet, Act 1, Scene 3)

by OJR on Jan 24, 2012 9:21 AM EST up reply actions  

Agreed

Fighters fight. Snitches Snitch.

by Deuce02 on Jan 24, 2012 10:46 AM EST up reply actions  

I can assure you Anderson has fought, and beaten the best competition with ease. Because he makes it easy doesn’t give you a reason to discredit him. You are saying Franklin is a better champion because he fought, and got his ass handed to him more times than Anderson. Whereas Anderson fought (same competition) and won with ease, so that makes Anderson somehow the lesser champion? No, it makes him great. He has won all his big fights, whereas Franklin hasn’t. He was won in dominant fashion, Franklin couldn’t do to Vitor what Anderson did to him. Franklin couldn’t do to Forrest what Anderson did to him.

Yes he should probably fight Bones, but Bones should fight Cain. At his age you are really gunning for him to fight a hungry lion like Jones, who is 1 weight above him? Your argument is invalid, are you aware that Anderson is injured now? The UFC run their doctors on fighters so it’s impossible to fake an injury, so what are you getting at? Provide facts or GTFO.

I don’t even like Anderson, I hate Ed Soars, but you can’t discredit his resume.

Bobby Southworth

by danago on Jan 24, 2012 10:07 AM EST reply actions  

fedor > gsp > bones > frankie > aldo > cruz > silva FACT!

This is not fact vhw

Hendo>Fedor so your number one fucks this all up

I don't try to intimidate anybody before a fight. That's nonsense. I intimidate people by hitting them.

by Puck Head on Jan 24, 2012 11:56 AM EST up reply actions  

He suffered

Bobby Southworth

by danago on Jan 24, 2012 12:01 PM EST up reply actions  

You haven’t got anything for me post kid, I just schooled you. Provide facts or get out of my face.

Bobby Southworth

by danago on Jan 25, 2012 7:14 AM EST up reply actions  

No one ducks as hard as GSP does, so hush. The guy is doing all he can to avoid Nick.

Bobby Southworth

by danago on Jan 25, 2012 7:14 AM EST up reply actions  

Even going as far as to have surgery on an ACL.

What surgery did Silva require to fix his shattered elbow? What’s that? He just rested the weekend and was fine on Monday you say?

lol

Overeem is sexy and he knows it.

by jay. on Jan 25, 2012 11:45 AM EST up reply actions  

he had a dance with jesus child and suddenly felt better

that’s the power of the bieber, people!

pride never die.

by vhw_ on Jan 25, 2012 12:25 PM EST up reply actions  

haha

Overeem is sexy and he knows it.

by jay. on Jan 25, 2012 4:19 PM EST up reply actions  

never underestimate The Beeb

not only did he heal Silva’s elbow, he resurrected his hair follicles and blessed him with a full head of luxurious James Brown hair! OW, it feels GOOD! Look out Rogain, here comes The Beeb!

"Who's da MASTA?!!!"

by (shonuff) on Jan 25, 2012 4:30 PM EST up reply actions  


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