Did Scott Coker help Dana White and the UFC create an MMA monopoly?
by Jesse Holland on Apr 5, 2011 9:58 AM EDT
in UFC News
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Go directly to Las Vegas. Do not pass San Jose, do not collect $200.
After nearly three months of closed door negotiations, Strikeforce CEO Scott Coker was able to find a suitable buyer for his San Jose-based fight promotion after his investors expressed an interest in getting out of the fight game and back to the business of ice hockey.
UFC President Dana White shocked the MMA world back on March 12 when he revealed that Zuffa, parent company of Ultimate Fighting Championship (UFC), was the proud new owner of what was widely considered the world's number two fight promotion.
If you're a fighter looking to make a career out of MMA, that leaves you very few choices when it comes to earning a living. Sure, you can compete at any one of the dozens of regional promotions across the country, but be prepared to hold a second (or third) job to support yourself.
Call it unfortunate, call it good business by the UFC, call it anything you want. But as Coker tells Heavy MMA, don't call it a monopoly.
"No, not at all. Two years ago, Strikeforce was a regional show. I promoted the Frank Shamrock and Cung Le fight in 2007, but it took us awhile to get our TV contract. But from 2009, when we got our Showtime fights, it took us two years to this point. It took a lot of hard work, but it can be recreated. Somebody out there has to step up and put the money behind it, and they can create the business just like I did and move from a regional promotion to a national promotion."
While both Strikeforce and UFC continue to operate as separate entities, most of the MMA community expects Zuffa to merge the brands much like it did with World Extreme Cagefighting (WEC) earlier this year.
Zuffa maintains the acquisition was not made as a "defensive maneuver" against rival investors like ProElite, but to grow the current roster and improve their position as they enter a global expansion.
With approximately 140 fighters under contract to Strikeforce, most fans wanted to know how quickly they can expect to see the best from both promotions get inside the cage and settle a couple of longstanding disputes, namely, who is the world's best fighter in each weight class.
That debate may not end anytime soon.
But when it does, how long before Zuffa begins to thin the herd? And will fighters be able to land on their feet? Anyone think an investor with deep pockets and a love for MMA would be willing to start a new promotion? And how do you convince the casual fan to care about it?
Anyone?
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I think investors will
Just not for the long haul. They’ll look to build up their promotion and sell like Coker did.
I'm sure another investor will come forth
And I’m even more sure Dana will like him at first, then hate him, then buy his promotion.
Same old same old.
Don't make sig bets with StrikerDave.
I think Mark Cuban is a good bet to start something up. He has that TV network and needs to fill airspace. And if he sees an opportunity to make some cash he’ll jump all over it.
Our lives change like the weather, but a legend never dies.
Mark Cuban Cant start shit.
Besides Dallas what else had he done. He has failed in getting an MMA organization, He failed at up lifting his team beyond contender status, he failed at getting the Texas Rangers, he lent money to the UFL and failed in getting the 5 million back in loans. What is crazy is that fool failed so hard he made money at it during the dot com boom. God that is crazy shit.
I've got something to say; it better to burn out than to fade away!!!
Wandy, Hendo, Vitor and Chael; the Berlin Wall of the Middle Weight top 10. Spitting, sensitive, sandy Brits (MB) need not apply.
Nerdsole Wars; X Box 4 life.
Besides Dallas wut else had he done?
U count Dallas as doing something =D
Seas of blood, bury life
Smell your death as it burns
Deep inside of you
Abacinate, eyes that bleed
Praying for the end of
Your wide awake nightmare
Wings of pain, reach out for you
His face of death staring down,
Your blood running cold
by d*locc on Apr 5, 2011 1:44 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
im actually looking forward to seeing bellator and mfc and so on step their game up.
There’s simply too many fighters out there, ufc’s cast offs are regional gold and I love prospecting.
If you spell Ndamukong Suh in Scrabble, you win. Forever...
by DetroitDrew1980 on Apr 5, 2011 10:17 AM EDT via mobile reply actions
UFC castoffs are practically useless.
That’s why they are castoffs.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
i've never been more excited for a jardine or marcus davis fight then i am for this weekend.
There’s someting about a change of promotion for a fighter that creates interest in my eyes. I used to hate jardine like no other and I will be rooting for him this weekend.
If you spell Ndamukong Suh in Scrabble, you win. Forever...
by DetroitDrew1980 on Apr 5, 2011 10:38 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Gotta agree
MFC cards are good and so are KOTC and XFC.
by Swedish Chef smerdy herdy verdy on Apr 5, 2011 10:45 AM EDT up reply actions
I'm still not excited about Davis or Jardine.
They just aren’t relevant.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
i feel bad for jardine, he's gonna get ko'd again
the dude should take a step back and think of his health. Marcus could probably switch careers too, he was doing alright in his last fight but the tko was brutal
Everything seems so much clearer now that bum Jon forcibly removed shogun’s dick out of my mouth. NNR for president and Tibau for FW…he’s just too small for LW
can someone answer me this..
Who owns strikeforce fighters contracts? Zuffa? Showtime? Could dana pull fighters from strikeforce to fight in the ufc right now? Or does he have to wait for the showtime contract to expire?
by meed55 on Apr 5, 2011 10:21 AM EDT via mobile reply actions
Only Fedor has a Showtime contract
And Yes Dana can pull fighters from the SF roster. I think he has to fulfill the TV contracts SF has, so he won’t be taking any of their fighters yet.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
UFC
is in the early stages of building a professional sport. Just like the NFL,NHL,NBA and MLB in North Amercia. I think that other organization oversea’s will eventually build UFC like promotions but in North America call it done. It’s going to be hard for any investor to step up to the plate when the UFC has now brought in a history of scooping up those any semi-successful promotions at cost.
The taste of blood......beautiful.
until ufc pays millions like those other professional sports it will be common for new investors to join the game.
If you spell Ndamukong Suh in Scrabble, you win. Forever...
by DetroitDrew1980 on Apr 5, 2011 10:27 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
They'll never pay millions to all their fighters
Same as boxing. The top guys will make bank while the little guy still starves. It will always be that way.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
if there lower tier guys dont have 6 figure saleries there will always be competition.
I’m not sure ufc dosnt want that competition, dana said before that he loves other promotions spending the money to build a guys name up before he signs them. No sport has every athlete making millions a year, but the gap between ufc and the others is far to wide for a monopoly to happen.
If you spell Ndamukong Suh in Scrabble, you win. Forever...
by DetroitDrew1980 on Apr 5, 2011 10:35 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Depends on what you consider competition.
SF wasn’t competition, Affliction wasn’t competition….
They haven’t really had any North American competition in years. I doubt that will ever change.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
Anyone who's on tv is their competition because UFC is a PPV model and none of the others are.
For as crappy as EliteXC was it got better ratings than UFC events because it was on free network TV.
by Swedish Chef smerdy herdy verdy on Apr 5, 2011 10:47 AM EDT up reply actions
That doesn't make them competition.
As is evident by their quick demise. They weren’t battling the UFC for top free agents. They were never “competition” for the UFC at all.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
Well Dana didn’t think he was worth the money he signed for with SF, you can’t tell me Dana didn’t want to retain Hendo’s services.
Hendo signed with Elite XC?
I must have missed that.
Did you read what we are talking about?
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
Just in the wrong spot.
And in that case…Dana said he’s not paying Dan. He let Dan leave to go fight for whoever he wanted. It’s not like SF outbid them or had any say in Dan’s future before Dana LET them.
It wasn’t a bidding war with a competitor. It was Dana giving SF his leftovers.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
BS
Hendo just came off of TUF and had a highlight reel KO of Bizz. His name was as big as it could get in the US.
HAHA
Have you ever taken the time to check his ratings? He has never drawn fans. Ever. He’s useless to a promotion regardless of his skills.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
yes, I understand that
Hendo felt like he was due more money. SF paid him that money. Dana said good riddance, I won’t pay you that much. You are telling me that if SF hadn’t offered him that contract that Hendo wouldn’t be fighting in the UFC right now? Really?
You got it out of order, bro.
Dana let him leave. THEN he talked to Scott. AFTER Dana said “goodbye”.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
I dono bout all that. He was a free agent for a while, but because there was COMPETITION to the UFC, Hendo was able to pack his bags and go make better money elsewhere. If there had been no viable competition Hendo would have been forced to stay with the UFC and Dana’s contract offer.
Or he could have left to fight for a Japanese outfit
Or Bellator…..
SF wasn’t the only other place to fight.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
Not really.
They may play the same game, but do you really think Bellator or anyone has a chance of beating the UFC without the UFC closing their own doors?
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
I think you have the wrong definition of competition here.
From Webster:
Competitor: one selling or buying goods or services in the same market as another.
And to answer your question, no Bellator isn’t taking out the UFC anytime soon. Having said that, Bellator is still competition for the UFC.
Yeah that’s true he’s never been a big draw, which i really never understood why?
But Dan still has a lot of fights left IMO, had he’s far from a push over.
My favorite K1 fighter:
Yuta Kubo the best 70kg striker in the world.
by Untitled_Artistry on Apr 5, 2011 11:21 AM EDT up reply actions
He's a boring fighter
His Pride fights for the most part are the cure for insomnia. (that word doesn’t look like it’s spelled right).
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
Lmao! Jay don't act like u seen his pride fights u fuckin liar!
U didn’t start watching mma till brick crossed over =D
Seas of blood, bury life
Smell your death as it burns
Deep inside of you
Abacinate, eyes that bleed
Praying for the end of
Your wide awake nightmare
Wings of pain, reach out for you
His face of death staring down,
Your blood running cold
by d*locc on Apr 5, 2011 12:58 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I haven't seen all of them.
I missed a lot of Pride because I wasn’t a fan of anybody and the tapes were difficult to get. I have seen a couple though. I’ve never said I was a Pride fan.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
Ask Scott if he would sign Dan again if given the chance.
He’s a flop.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
You said he was coming off TUF and the Bisping win.
I said ask Scott if he cares about that. It did nothing to help with his popularity.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
Disagree their
Dan was not leftovers. My understanding about the situation was that he felt he deserved a rematch with Anderson, but Dana didn’t think so.
My favorite K1 fighter:
Yuta Kubo the best 70kg striker in the world.
by Untitled_Artistry on Apr 5, 2011 11:19 AM EDT up reply actions
True, he doesn't bring the ratings
but still a top tier fighter.
My favorite K1 fighter:
Yuta Kubo the best 70kg striker in the world.
by Untitled_Artistry on Apr 5, 2011 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions
I cant agree with that myself
He was good in Pride for a period but he has never been great by any means
enzo
by enzo-enormous on Apr 5, 2011 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions
Couldn't disagree more
Dude held belts in 2 major mma organizations, competed in the olympics and the pan ams. Calling the Pride Middleweight champ anything but great is setting the bar really fucking high man.
He accomplished some things yes...
But I have never felt that he was great. He was overlooked by some fighters for sure. I do like the guy and I am a fan, but he is a choker too. He went thru his best fights already imo
enzo
by enzo-enormous on Apr 5, 2011 11:28 AM EDT up reply actions
I’m not so sure about that, ppl have always slept of Dan’s wins.
He’s beaten many prominent fighters, and has only managed to lose to great fighters as well. He’s accomplished the MW Pride title and has some great wins under his belt since then.
My favorite K1 fighter:
Yuta Kubo the best 70kg striker in the world.
by Untitled_Artistry on Apr 5, 2011 11:29 AM EDT up reply actions
What are his great wins since then?
Im not trolling either. I am being totally serious
enzo
by enzo-enormous on Apr 5, 2011 11:30 AM EDT up reply actions
Bisping
A quality win over Rich, who was coming off 2 quality win’s after the Anderson massacre.
And his recent win over Cavalcante.
My favorite K1 fighter:
Yuta Kubo the best 70kg striker in the world.
by Untitled_Artistry on Apr 5, 2011 11:45 AM EDT up reply actions
Well cavalcante is no world beater by any means
And Rich is totally irrelevant now
enzo
by enzo-enormous on Apr 5, 2011 11:46 AM EDT up reply actions
Yeah but the Rich win at that time had some a lot of stature to it.
And his only loss over the past 2 years or so was to Jake Shields IMO (who is gonna finish GSP) is top tier fighter.
My favorite K1 fighter:
Yuta Kubo the best 70kg striker in the world.
by Untitled_Artistry on Apr 5, 2011 11:56 AM EDT up reply actions
Rich has been irrelevant since he fought AS the second time
enzo
by enzo-enormous on Apr 5, 2011 12:04 PM EDT up reply actions
I guess so… if a guy loses twice to a AS who at that time was defending the MW title, and winning every fight by finishes.
My favorite K1 fighter:
Yuta Kubo the best 70kg striker in the world.
by Untitled_Artistry on Apr 5, 2011 12:06 PM EDT up reply actions
I didnt say it was because of that
I said it was sense then. He hasnt done anything sense then. He isnt the same fighter now. He was a dominant champ for a while, but then he got passed up by better people. He hasnt evolved. Give me a break. Do you really see Ace as a contender? Seriously?
enzo
by enzo-enormous on Apr 5, 2011 12:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Do you really see Ace as a contender? Seriously?
Oh of course not.
But we were referencing Rich at that specific time frame around 2008 or so.
Which at that time had some meaning behind it.
My favorite K1 fighter:
Yuta Kubo the best 70kg striker in the world.
by Untitled_Artistry on Apr 5, 2011 12:14 PM EDT up reply actions
That is where I disagree
What did he do after his second fight with AS? And btw, Im not knocking on Ace. I really like Ace and am a fan… just like im a fan of Chuck… but neither are the same fighter. Not even close. They helped the sport, but got passed by
enzo
by enzo-enormous on Apr 5, 2011 12:15 PM EDT up reply actions
Quality win over Okami.
Finishing Travis Lutter, and i believe he also finished Matt Hammil. And finishing a Jason Mc Donald at that time who was on an impressive win streak.
My favorite K1 fighter:
Yuta Kubo the best 70kg striker in the world.
by Untitled_Artistry on Apr 5, 2011 12:36 PM EDT up reply actions
lol I cant really see why we are arguing
I feel like you are grasping at straws… Okami is the only one on there worth mentioning at all
enzo
by enzo-enormous on Apr 5, 2011 12:42 PM EDT up reply actions
Ok...
Except that isnt what I said
enzo
by enzo-enormous on Apr 5, 2011 12:10 PM EDT up reply actions
TV ratings mean nothing in this.
SF had great Russian TV ratings for the Fedor fights. How did that work out for them? They didn’t get any money for it.
That doesn’t make them competition at all.
Kimbo Slice used to get millions of views of his street fights on You-Tube. Was he a competitor with the UFC?
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
If Seth didn't KO him, he sure as hell was.
He is still in 4 of the most watched MMA fights EVER. Regardless of talent, Kimbo is a perfect example of how easy it is to market MMA to a “mainstream” crowd and is an example for the next guy out there willing to lose $10mm hoping he can pick a guy that actually can fight and get him on “free” tv. Whoever can do that can put some fear into DW.
It shouldn't have taken Seth's KO for you guys to realize he was a can.
In the end he wouldn’t have been competition for the UFC because talent always wins out.
People would have gotten bored with him regardless of his opponents because people want to see good fighters. He was never a good fighter.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
Yea no kidding
Kimbo was a joke from the beginning. I was blown away that so many people actually thought he was going to be a force. He has no skills at all. Never did and he never will
enzo
by enzo-enormous on Apr 5, 2011 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions
No
And that’s why it doesn’t matter if Seth knocked him out. The people that were watching his fights would have gotten bored of him eventually anyway. He was talentless.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
That is true but some people say the same thing about Brock. They just dismiss all his fans as pro wrestling fans. Kimbo as talentless as he was made Elite XC competition to the UFC for a brief period of time.
There is no reason to talk to the people that say those things, Jimbob.
They are retarded.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
IMO the thing that attracted viewers to watch him was just his overall apperance. A guy that looked like the 2nd the last boss of a fighting video game. Viewers already knew what was going to happen to the man, but still just wanted to see what might of happened.
My favorite K1 fighter:
Yuta Kubo the best 70kg striker in the world.
by Untitled_Artistry on Apr 5, 2011 11:32 AM EDT up reply actions
and that fad brought more eyes to MMA than anyone else has EVER
that is the point jay. The sport is so young you don’t need talent to succeed. The audience is there for afighter that can combine the best of GSP and Kimbo to make this sport into something huge.
So far you are wrong.
Talent has won out in every single case thus far.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
The UFC's talent has beaten all the sideshows.
Nothing to do with Kimbo.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
Until a "talented" fighter breaks Kimbo's records, we will disagree
This “sport” is about putting asses in the seats. Kimbo did that better than anyone else, regardless of talent level.
I don't understand what records he broke and why anyone would care to break them.
It did literally nothing for him or Elite XC.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
He would have gotten that pay with no viewers/
I’m talking viewers only. People watching on free tv does nothing for Kimbo.
Fedor did millions of views in Russia, what did he get for it?
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
Do you understan how "free" TV works??
Are you telling me that the NFL doesn’t make any money on free TV? That is what it sounds like, jay.
Advertising dollars, my friend. Kinda like how Mania is “free”. Does Jesse not get paid?
Well you would think SF and Elite would have had money than, right?
It obviously isn’t that simple.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
SF did have money, or UD would have let them go belly up and picked over the remians
Elite did as well, or they wouldn’t have been able to afford Kimbo the second or third times. They just had poor management of money.
Don’t think for one second that TV is not an avenue to beat the UFC’s PPV model.
Don't let history or common sense get in the way of your POV.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
I think ppl wanted to see is the street thug from Miami
could actually throw down with some pros. They learned very quickly that he could not. You hear nothing about him now because the fad went away as soon as ppl realized he was a joke. He was popular because of youtube… now is has like 0 fans
enzo
by enzo-enormous on Apr 5, 2011 11:39 AM EDT up reply actions
People would have gotten bored with him
you mean the 4 million or so that made his TUF fight the largest watched spisode ever, even after he lost to Seth?
You are funny in that you have absolutely no idea how this guy was marketed and you only see his talent or lack thereof, but you believe that Nick Diaz has talent. They are one in the same, but one hasn’t been put in a position to lose recently.
FYI, I never believed Kimbo had talent, but a whole shit-ton of people tuned in to watch him. Because of the ratings, it didn’t matter if he could actually fight.
Kimbo and Diaz are one in the same?
You lost me. Diaz isn’t being promoted despite his talent, he’s being promoted because of his talent.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
totally disagree.
We have had this conversation before. Nick is a talk-slot about nothing street punk that loses to every decent wreslter he fights at 170. Sure he has more talent than Kimbo, but he is a perfect example of a guy that would go .500 (actually did go .500) in the UFC, but was marketed perfectly for people to actually believe he is a challenger to GSP when, in fact, ha has fought NO ONE of consequence outside of the UFC.
You're not going to convince me Diaz doesn't deserve his rank.
I’ve shown you the ranks, tell me who deserves to be higher than Diaz that isn’t already. He’s not overrated.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
and you will never convince me he deserves your ranking
He is overrated and has purposely avoided wrestlers, whether it was his intent or Coker’s, we will never know.
Not my ranking, dude.
It’s the concensus ranking. He’s ranked 8th and not one fighter below him deserves to be ranked higher.
You can say “he doesn’t deserve to be ranked 8th”, but that means nothing if you can’t name one single fighter that should be above him.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
+1
My favorite K1 fighter:
Yuta Kubo the best 70kg striker in the world.
by Untitled_Artistry on Apr 5, 2011 12:11 PM EDT up reply actions
Kampmann?
Are you trolling me?
Daley will get his chance, but I find it funny you say Diaz doesn’t deserve to be ranked 8th because he can’t wrestle yet you want Daley to be 8th O_o
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
Yes Daley, wo beat Kampmann who beat #6 Condit.
Funny how those things work…
Who again in the top 10 did Nick beat? Ohhhhhhhh that’s right. NO ONE.
I can’t wait for Daley to KO that clown…
HA…
Your ignorance and hatered is blinding you. Just so… miss guided.
My favorite K1 fighter:
Yuta Kubo the best 70kg striker in the world.
by Untitled_Artistry on Apr 5, 2011 12:22 PM EDT up reply actions
He hasn't avoided any wrestlers.
There isn’t any for him to fight.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
There is nobody of consequence outside the UFC.
They have 8 of the top 10. Of course Diaz isn’t beating top 5’s, they all fight for the UFC.
Same old argument with massive bias.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
no bias, honestly
Nick loses to wrestlers at 170. He didn’t fight any outside of the UFC, even though SF had two very accomplished wresters, one of whom beat Nick in the UFC, on its roster. Why is that?
Do you not think Heiron or Riggs were more credible opponents at the time than KJ, Scott Smith or Frank Shamrock?
You guys are counting fights from 8 years ago for today's rankings?
How convenient.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
no point in bringing up the stupid riggs & heiron examples.... Nick agreed to fight both of those guys before he took any of those fights u mentioned.
how the hell is Nick scared of wrestlers when he signed a contract for that Riggs rematch…
he signed a goddamn contract!~
who said scared? I said avoided
big difference.
Why did he not re-sign to fight either after the injuries were healed? Again, were they not more credible than KJ, Frank or Scott Smith?
dood~ he signed a contract! 1st i need you to explain how that could possibly mean he 'avoided' them.
my guess to why they didn’t get re booked is because Nick doesn’t choose his opponents, he takes the fights offered.. he has been offered both the guys you named(heiron & riggs) AND he agreed to take both..
face it ulf. you cant use riggs and heiron as excuses anymore.. that shit is pointless..
you hate diaz – move on
LMAO
damn you and your ridiculous facts!!!
I will troll if I want to!! I am tired of you ruining my Nick bashing. ;)
Matt Serra beat GSP.
Chonan beat Anderson Silva.
Please stop trolling me.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
Jay. just stop…
B/C Ulf is just trolling/ stirring up the pot with some ridiclious arguments.
It’s clear how much he physically hates Diaz, that he just throws his entire skill level out the window.
My favorite K1 fighter:
Yuta Kubo the best 70kg striker in the world.
by Untitled_Artistry on Apr 5, 2011 12:31 PM EDT up reply actions
Please remember who was giving you this argument when Nick fails miserably in the UFC, AGAIN.
but yes, there is a bit of trolling going on. ;)
You are funny in that you have absolutely no idea how this guy was marketed and you only see his talent or lack thereof, but you believe that Nick Diaz has talent. They are one in the same, but one hasn’t been put in a position to lose recently.
What the hell are you talking about?
Nick Diaz and Kimbo Slice should never be mentioned in the same sentence. WTF, get out of here man. Nick is a well rounded and peer fighter. Kimbo is street fighter with no dedication or physical skill. Diaz is pure talent, hard work, and skill.
My favorite K1 fighter:
Yuta Kubo the best 70kg striker in the world.
by Untitled_Artistry on Apr 5, 2011 11:38 AM EDT up reply actions
a slight stretch on my part
Nick is a .500 guy at 170 in the UFC and is a poster boy for how easy it is to become a name outside of the UFC with the right marketing dollars behind you and a good “heel” persona.
not to be overly, overly technical here..
But Nick is not .500 in the UFC.. he’s 6-4 = .600
not like it’s the biggest deal, but he’s better than 50%..
u also overlook things like
Diaz hasn’t fought in the ufc since 2006.. thats a long time..
when he was fighting for the ufc he was a very young age 19 to 23..
ALL 4 of his losses come via decision with one of them being split..
He was riding a 2 fight win streak and left the UFC..
He left the UFC as a free agent, and was never ‘cut by them’
he had an offer to renew his contract with zuffa and chose not to..
The Diaz haters are hilarious.
The lies are nonstop.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
what lie? I rounded down
he was closer to .500 than .750, no? It suited my argument. You should know my proclivity for using stats in my favor, jay. ;)
And I never said Nick was cut. I know how he left.
I also know if you stack up all the “great” victories Nick had outside of the UFC you can’t possibly come up with a top 10 fighter unless you fight in a division, with a dominant champion, that needs contenders to be fabricated. guys like Dan Hardy.
haha.. Nick has 10 fights in the ufc, u dont need to round up or down, it's simple percentage..
i dont buy that for one second.. im more inclined to think you keep forgetting Nick left the UFC with back 2 back wins instead of 3 straight losses and ‘cut’ by dana..
what lie? I rounded down he was closer to .500 than .750, no?
two things I can get jay on every time
Nick Diaz
GSP (but I stay away from this one, we don’t need a Mania tsunami)
And here comes stink-man to ruin my fun…
Nick is a .500 guy at 170 in the UFC and is a poster boy for how easy it is to become a name outside of the UFC with the right marketing dollars behind you and a good "heel" persona.
He’s far from a poster boy, come on now. He has quality wins and amazing talents. IMO its tough to have gained such a guge fan base after leaving the top north american organization and exploring to other companies, during that period in time. I’m not sure if he’s “heel”
My favorite K1 fighter:
Yuta Kubo the best 70kg striker in the world.
by Untitled_Artistry on Apr 5, 2011 11:49 AM EDT up reply actions
please describe how good talent is need to beat Scott Smith and Marius Zaromski?
“Don’t be scared Homie”?
double birds to Shamrock?
Cage Brawl?
Go drink some kool-aide, Coker makes it really strong for you…
Jay
Why do you always discredit TV ratings? Kimbo pulled in 6.5 million on CBS. You think he wasn’t a threat to UFC? Put EliteXC and Kimbo on as a counter-programming alternative to any UFC Fight Night and it’s no contest.
Unfortunately he got exposed by Petruzelli (I believe he would have KOed Scamrock) but he was a huge threat and the EliteXC shows were blowing Zuffa away on free TV.
If that’s not true, they wouldn’t have used Kimbo to bolster their own TUF 10 ratings.
It is not enough to succeed. Others must fail.
by Jesse Holland on Apr 5, 2011 11:38 AM EDT up reply actions
I have like 7 people trying to nail me. Bring it, punks.
TV ratings haven’t been worth squat so far. Elite was drawing all those fans and what happened? They closed due to insufficient funds.
If TV ratings mattered, SF would still be open because supposedly Fedor drew over 5 million in Russia.
Maybe none of these guys have good deals with their sponsors or something? But TV ratings hasn’t saved anyone yet so they mean very little to me.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
I fully agree with you man
People obviously showed an interest… that isnt the argument. The argument is if they are really competition to the UFC. They arent here any longer because they couldnt hack it. Even when they had higher ratings, they still didnt have the backing or the business sense… that is why they arent relevant. They are no longer here. They werent competition imo
It was a good effort on their part tho
enzo
by enzo-enormous on Apr 5, 2011 11:44 AM EDT up reply actions
Elite XC was ran poorly and didn’t have the capital to survive. That doesn’t mean they weren’t taking views away from the UFC.
Numbers were about the same then as they are now.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
Why?
People become disinterested, can’t afford PPVs (I personally know this is true because I have recently started to download PPV’s instead of buying all of them.
Also the economy hasn’t been doing so well the last couple years so that had to have played a part.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
If the numbers a reality the same as 2 – 3 years ago that’s ok. Your right about the sport growing and all, but your in the age of “piracy.”
Its going to be downloaded all over the web/ streamed live.
My favorite K1 fighter:
Yuta Kubo the best 70kg striker in the world.
by Untitled_Artistry on Apr 5, 2011 11:52 AM EDT up reply actions
Maybe I am taking the word "competition" wrong here.
I mean they aren’t competition for UFC’s spot at the top.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
That is definitely true. They are just low level competition. Dana doesn’t want any competition because that means there is money he may not be getting.
any dollar made from MMA that isn’t going into the Zuffa machine is competition to the Zuffa machine.
That's sort of a loose definition.
All competition is equal than?
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
of course not man
some are more of a threat than others. Dana obviously saw value in SF as they dished out millions for it.
What sort of threat do you think SF posed to UFC if Dana hadn't bought them?
They were losing money hand over fist because Scott made the deal with the devil (Fedor).
After they signed Fedor I knew it was only a matter of time before SF closed. They would have died without Dana buying them. The minute they signed to work with M1, they were no longer a threat to anyone but themselves.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
of course not, that is not the argument
but the local hardware store 3 blocks from my house is competition to Wal-mart, just like Wal-mart was competition to K-mart, Sear Roebuck, and Hills 40 years ago.
To tell the truth even though there is a Super Wal-Mart in my hometown they couldn’t crush our local hardware store either. The rest of main street they pretty much decimated though. Ma and Pa clothing stores or toy stores never really stood a chance.
I have several hardware stores available for me
I always end up back at home depot. The ma and pa store comes with a sense that the owners are mad you are asking questions. At the depot, I get plans drawn out for me for whatever job I am doing. Weird how that works out for me.
really?
the “handyman” at my local harware stoer might be the smartest Mofo I have ever met when it comes to remodeling. He is a regular Macguyver for my 110 year old house.
no shit man
I have like 3 guys I talk to at home depot. Always have the answers. The guy at the local store is a friggin prick.
Exposure does matter
It’s not a question of whether any other organization has better talent than the UFC. It’s a question of marketability and availability.
Remember that MMA is a professional entertainment sport not an institution like NCAA. That means it comes down to $$. People won’t buy what they perceive they can have for free.
by Swedish Chef smerdy herdy verdy on Apr 6, 2011 12:15 PM EDT up reply actions
have to disagree
if it weren’t competition, UD wouldn’t be airing recent PPV’s in the same timeslots…..
He also airs recent PPV's at the same time as Jersey Shore reruns.
Is he battling them as well?
Having the same timeslot as someone else doesn’t make that company competition. SF was never a competitor with the UFC. That’s like saying Mom and Pop stores are competition with 7-11. Just because they sort of work in the same field doesn’t make them competition.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
But they were competition…
For the simple reason that Dana decided to buy out SF, and has brought over specific fighters from other organizations. IMO bring over a quality fighter from a well known organization is competition.
My favorite K1 fighter:
Yuta Kubo the best 70kg striker in the world.
by Untitled_Artistry on Apr 5, 2011 11:10 AM EDT up reply actions
None of this makes any sense.
Clean it up and repost it.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
Example/
Would you say Cott Cola is a competitor with Pepsi?
Right now the UFC doesn’t have a “Coke” and they never have. They’ve had a few Cott’s and PC’s, but no Coke.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
Really…
None of this makes any sense.
Clean it up and repost it.
What is Cott?
My favorite K1 fighter:
Yuta Kubo the best 70kg striker in the world.
by Untitled_Artistry on Apr 5, 2011 11:12 AM EDT up reply actions
curious
I like to get to know the “new” maniacs". Mind giving me your insight into the following?
1. Fedor
2. Fedor
3. Puck Head
haha
Continue on your witch hunt then. Wasting your time I tells ya.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
Just asking a question
He still hasn’t answered. I am sure he isn’t going to oust himself as SD. But, one can hope.
Who or what is this SD you guys are speaking of?
My favorite K1 fighter:
Yuta Kubo the best 70kg striker in the world.
by Untitled_Artistry on Apr 5, 2011 11:26 AM EDT up reply actions
he joined in september
that being said, fedor is the greastest fighter ever
Everything seems so much clearer now that bum Jon forcibly removed shogun’s dick out of my mouth. NNR for president and Tibau for FW…he’s just too small for LW
Oh never heard of it before.
Similar to Mr. pibbs and dr. pepper.
My favorite K1 fighter:
Yuta Kubo the best 70kg striker in the world.
by Untitled_Artistry on Apr 5, 2011 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions
Probably closer to Mr. Pibbs, whatever that is.
Dr Pepper is made by Pepsi or Coke, I think.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
You don’t have to be on the same level as another company to be competition. Barnes and Noble ate up a shitton of Ma and Pa bookstores. Not anywhere near the same type of company, not anywhere near the same amount of profits, but still competition.
You think it was a coincidence that UD aired UFC PPV on free TV during SF events? Come on man.
Is that the only two things that were on TV at that time?
If so, I agree with you. If not, I would have to say Dana was competing with SF as much as any other show that was on TV at that time.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
Jay is just being belligerent on purpose now. If you really believe that he wasn’t intentionally counter programming Strikeforce specifically there is no point to continuing this conversation.
That isn't my point.
My point is (before I did start trolling you here) that just because they counter-programmed SF, doesn’t mean SF was ever a real competitor with UFC.
UFC counter-programs hockey games and all sorts of shit. They want eyes on their product.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
you put UD on a pedestal as having no real competitors. But man, you don’t buy a company because you think it sucks and poses no real threat to your bottom line.
The UFC PPV buys are still same as always.
He bought them because Scott probably asked him to bail him out.
MMA is a losing money venture if you don’t get the number one slot. Regardless of your stable of fighters, if you aren’t number one there isn’t a lot of money in North America for you.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
Yees
they were in meetings for months before the buy-out. Do you have insider info saying Dana initiated all talks?
It is more likely that Scott asked to be bought out than it is that Dana talked him into selling when he didn’t want to.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
you make it sound as though
Dana just bought SF to do SF a favor. If there wasn’t money to be made with the deal, it wouldn’t have been made.
Disagree
UFC bought Affliction with no money to be made. Actually they lost money on that deal.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
because I don't think that ever happened
Affliction quit the promotion business and got back to focusing on T-shirts, which is why Dana let them back into the UFC.
Dana told them if they cancel their promotion he will let them promote his fighters again.
Chicken and egg situation here.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
I don't get it.
SMH? You have some sort of proof that what you said is correct?
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
You have Dana up on a serious pedestal brother. You think Affliction folded because Dana told them too?
No
I said Dana said they can sponsor fighters again if they agree to stop holding events. That is what happened.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
The way you type things out on this you would think that Affliction closed their doors simply so they could sponsor fighters in the UFC again.
It was the only way they made money.
They were losing money with Fedor around.
They did like 110,000 buys with their two shows.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
They weren't going to stop promoting their show if Dana didn't let his fighters wear their clothes.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
What hockey games are they specifically counter programming? When Strikeforce had a big event Dana would put one of their recent big events on free TV. He targeted them because they were competition and he wanted to take as many eyes off them as possible. Even though they were small they were still competition.
NHL hockey games.
They come on on Saturday night at 1000, just like UFC. Coincidence? I think not.
Believers please keep your religion.....to yourself.
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