How many of these five Heavyweight UFC fighter's beat Fedor E.
by wolfmanshowlforever on Mar 22, 2010 6:30 AM EDT
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Print1: Brock Lesnar when he is supposedly 100% healthy around July 4th of this year. 2: Frank Mir after he beats Shane Carwin imo. 3: Cain Velasquez who just won a quick victory over Noguiera. 4: Junior Dos Santos after the beatdown of Gabriel Gonzaga. 5: Shane Carwin if he does or does not beat Frank Mir. Four of these men a many years younger than Fedor and in my opinion two of them would beat him and maybe three. What is your opinion?
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All 5 have a chance. Too bad we won't see them anytime soon. M-1 Sucks.
The world is a dangerous place to live - not because of the people who are evil but because of the people who don't do anything about it. - Albert Einstein
All 5 have a chance statistically.....
Fedor 70 / Brock 30
Fedor 80 / Mir 20
Fedor 90 / Carwin 10
Fedor 85 / Cain 15
Fedor 80 / JDS 20
All five have a chance, but Fedor would have to be the favorite in every fight.
’’Apparently, the only way to kill a lion is by rear naked choke… Personally I’d just kick it in the head.’’ – Bas Rutten
make this into a poll
I’d say 3, maybe 4
I disagree with what you say, but I will fight to the death for your right to say it
by PHISH NATION on Mar 22, 2010 3:33 PM EDT up reply actions
you must be joking. if the fights happen it would probably be a year or a year and half away.
the stats on fedor almost 35. 5 feet 11 inches even though they say he is 6 feet tall. 238 pds for last fight. my guess is he would be at least 242 for a fight with any of these guys and that belly fat of his would be bigger. i hope the handicappers would think like you do. lesnar would be around a +215 moneyline and i would put 500 dollars on that.
I'm all about covering the spread and moneylines. I was building a house, I don't deserve this, deserves have nothing to do with it. Bang. "Unforgiven" I drink your milkshake. I drink it up! "There Will BE Blood"
by wolfmanshowlforever on Mar 23, 2010 3:53 PM EDT up reply actions
No shot
I give BRock the only chance.
The other guys dont have the striking nor the gound to dominate Fedor.
Wayne Gretsky, Michael Jordan, Joe Montana, Muhammed Ali, FEDOR EMELIANKO
No shot?????
Why do you think that Zack? Roger’s had fedor on the ropes, hurt him. I dont see rogers having a chance to touch these 5. It is conceivable that all 5 can beat Fedor. The competition in UFC HW is bringing out the best in these guys. Fedor in the meantime gets to hand pick opponents.
Some can't get out of the Pride days whardiek
They believe the Pride guys were god and Fedor was the HW god and fighters now would have no chance but if one of them loses even though they are only 34 years old they are past their Prime LOL, Good fans but very biased. It’s obvious the sport has evolved as has it’s fighters. Barnett was the best big HW back in pride at 255ish now imagine 30 pounds of muscle added and much more athletisime. Imagine that guy would steam role through the Pride HW division then?
"Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth - Mike Tyson
good one Puck Head
The bad thing is; Fedor isn’t gonna be in the UFC anytime soon. I would love nothing more than to put this baby to bed. First, Wandy vs.Chuck, then Fedor vs. Randy. and Now Brock vs. Fedor. I’m almost to the point that if Fedor fights in UFC it would be anti-climactic. I almost don’t wanna know.
You would but it would have to happen in the next two years otherwise the excuses that he isn't the same would start
"Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth - Mike Tyson
Puck you are right
I love Fedor as much as anyone. But, the minute he loses, the excuses are flowing like crazy. The truth of the matter is, everyone gets beat, time waits for no one. And Fedor doesn’t need to prove himself to anyone. He can go down in folk lore as the HW pied piper. The old boxing arguement; Ali is better than- fill in the blank.
Yeah but at the same time his management may see this and prefer he fights older experienced figthers
Over the new breed and if they can make the same money why not?
"Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth - Mike Tyson
youre right again puck
Fedor’s camp is trying to preserve his legacy, not forge a new one. I really think they don’t want to risk Fedor’s credibility by signing in the UFC. Why else would we hear rumors involving Fedor vs. Yoshida, Barnett, Overeem, Werdum. Brett rogers was the only name to buck that trend. M-1 are careful handpick the right fights. It’s no different than boxing in my eyes.
Exactly whardiek M1 is like a typical boxers management team
And if it was up to them they would have a card with just Fedor on it and a bunch of BS fights. there is rumors that they are going to hold a event with Fedor on it agaisnt Yoshida? Luckily for us many of us understand why boxing has been going down hill because of this BS and are agaisnt the managment teams getting so much out of one fighter adn leaving the rest to pick up scraps.
"Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth - Mike Tyson
Wait
So Rogers is old? Id like to see what guys would say if the strikeforce heavyweights were in the UFC or Vice Versa. U UFC nuthuggers are just that. THE UFC is Just a name thats all. Rogers would def KO Carwin and be at a top spot period. Carwin hasnt beat anyone close to Arlovski. Arlovski is still one of the top guys… Come on UFC nuthuggers stop hatin.
No one in the HW division has striking like Fedor. Carwin is too stiff and so is Cain. Dos Santos might give the best fight with his boxing.. jsut like Andrei did. Also Brock hass to be the front runner due to his dominant wrestling. But seriously stop hating.. Dana white has his Dick so far up most of you guys asses its not even funny. I respect the fighter not the PROMOTION. JUMP OFF
Wayne Gretsky, Michael Jordan, Joe Montana, Muhammed Ali, FEDOR EMELIANKO
by The real ZACK on Mar 22, 2010 8:45 PM EDT up reply actions
If you read any of the other post you would see I stated Rogers was one of the new generation of fighters zack
Fact is your obssession of Fedor clouds your judgment my friend. We seen Timmy, AA and Werdum all in the UFC and lose so it’s easier to judge their talent level. There is no hate on my side against Fedor just M1 and I even state Fedor is the greatest ever but becasue I think no the best anymore you guys get your panties in a knot?
I see the sport evolve at one time only a dozen or so HW fighters in the UFC and Pride could train year round and fight year round and many that did used only their base and were not trained like everyone is now against certain styles the reason you seen guy’s like Gracie and NOG win so many fights with jjis because of the lack of training against jj. That has totally changed now days. Fedor was probally the most well rounded fighter and one of very few that could compete in any position.
In america one of the largest populated countries for athletes had very low% in MMA at this time and that has changed. And I see much better tactical gameplans used by all fighters and those with the better abilities and most determination will usually win and with Fedor not testing himself against the new breed of MMA fighters like he should also makes me sceptical of how he will do against the well trained new generation of fighters.
Anyway calling me a hater is just becasue I think he’s going to lose is naive ZACK I love Alves but think he will lose if he faces GSP, I love Wandy and think he was one of the greatest ever and my personal fauvorite of all time but I don’t think he’s the best anymore, does that make me a hater? No it doesn’t so please stop using hater and nut hugger in your debate it makes you sound ignorant
"Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth - Mike Tyson
Where and when
was Fedor hurt in th ROgers fight? Just because he landed doesnt mean he hurt fedor.
Wayne Gretsky, Michael Jordan, Joe Montana, Muhammed Ali, FEDOR EMELIANKO
by The real ZACK on Mar 22, 2010 4:54 PM EDT up reply actions
Im interested to hear what you see in these fighters that makes you think tey would beat Fedor.
not just their names and that you think you’d beat them
Loyality before Reality
oh silly brendog, haven't you heard
Fedor doesn’t fight real competition. He’s just a can crusher. He doesn’t fight for the Glorious Fuhrer, Comrade Dana, therefore he must be a can himself. Herr Fuhrer says Randy Couture could beat him with one hand tied behind his back. If Fedor was worth his salt and was a real fighter, he’d be in the UFC…just like Kimbo Slice!
Brendog I'll bite.
the mixture of size, speed, power, agility and overall talent is something Fedor has only seen a few times. Randleman, Arlovski, Nogueria and Lindland have some of these skills, some more than others. But, IMO, The UFC 5 take these things to another level, primarily because their size. I would like to know who Fedor fought that would rival any of the UFC 5? So, I say UFC 5 show Fedor something he hasn’t seen yet.
Yeah NOG is the same fighter he was in Pride
Maybe he could take more of a beating in Pride than he can now but skill wise the same, yes CC is hard to compare to but NO relied heavily for to many years on his JJ game alone and was a one dimensional fighter against anyone decent. CC had leg kicks and was proablly the best total striker Fedor has faced to date but besides CC injury CC looks much better in a ring than a octagon he doesn’t look good against a cage at all. Now then there is also Barnett the biggest of all these guys and considered the #2 guy for years his stand up was brutal but his ground game was excellent as he used his size advantage very wisely but if he couldn’t bring you to the mat he was in trouble. Some great HW but as the sport evolves the fighters get better like every other sport. Is Fedor the top dog still? All opinion but If he ever does come to the UFC I wouldn’t bet on him in every fight,
"Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth - Mike Tyson
Okay
Just who have the “UFC 5” fought to rival Fedor? Or even scratch the surface to rival Fedor?
hard for a 'tard
L E E
I wasn’t impling that they have fought Fedor, or his caliber. I was saying Fedor hasn’t fought the new Breed of HW. I’m not slamming Fedor. I want to see him fight any of the UFC 5 over anyone else in the world. Moreover, I was saying why they had a chance against Fedor.
I understand your point
but my question still applies. I don’t see anyone any of them have fought that are near Fedor in skill, punching power, speed, and strength.
hard for a 'tard
L E E
You really think Anyone Fedor has fought has more punching power than JDS? Carwin? Lesnar? Cain? Mir? Fedor has fought big guys, i.e. zulu, hong man choi but no big man Fedor has fought moves like Lesnar, carwin, cain, or mir. Now, JDS has similarities to Cro cop. I guess we will agree to disagree. I don’t see any of Fedor’s opponents with overall skill sets as complete as the UFC 5.
If Russia attacked Turkey from the rear, Do you think Greece would help?
Honestly
I think Hong and Rogers hit harder than any of them, cept for Carwin. JDS has the best technique of them all, but AA has better technique. but I will say I do not see JDS doing a stupid flying knee. Fedor’s standup might look sloppy, but it’s often quite technical in itself and he makes up for it with extremely fast hands, great power behind the fast punches, and great reflexes.
hard for a 'tard
i agree
I’m not slamming Fedor bro. I have been a fan for years. I think the new hw is a bad match up for him. I hong and rogers may hit hard, but, do you really think Rogers has a chance against any of the 5? AA does have the best technique, but, the worst chin. I just want Fedor in UFC to put this baby to bed. All the speculation.
If Russia attacked Turkey from the rear, Do you think Greece would help?
I am officially trolling, sorry Mania....
M-1 SUCKS
I hate this F’ing argument because M-1 SUCKS.
The world is a dangerous place to live - not because of the people who are evil but because of the people who don't do anything about it. - Albert Einstein
by Ulf Murphy on Mar 22, 2010 4:05 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I agree as well
In that Fedor should be in the UFC. It’s what most of us want. However, I would say Rogers could do pretty well in the UFC. Not saying he’d beat them all, but better than you’d expect. AA has the best chance striking with Fedor because he’s a much better strike-down-the-middle style boxer. JDS isn’t. He’s more a looping counter-puncher. Love watching the guy, but I don’t see him landing on Fedor before Fedor lands on him. And even if he did, not sure he’d hurt Fedor a ton, as I feel JDS’s power isn’t all that great. The worst matchup for Fedor would be Lesnar or Cain. They can get him down, land some punches and then the fight gets stopped. Don’t pretend like there aren’t a lot of early GnP stoppages in MMA—especially the UFC.
hard for a 'tard
rogers
I like rogers. rogers vs buentello would be a fun fight to watch. I dont think he would do good in the ufc. I will disagree about Fedor, we are making the same points over and over. Yet still disagree. Sign with UFC Fedor and let’s find out the truth.
If Russia attacked Turkey from the rear, Do you think Greece would help?
This guy feels jds's power isnt all that great lol
Wow what a fucking retard
AA has upside but I don't know if he can beat big timmy yet
he has a lot to prove before I think of him as any threat, he has the tools to get there but he is fighting way under his potential and has for some time. Rogers is like Carwin really unknown at thsi time he did well for fighting Fedor and was a close fight until Fedor nailed him with a a little more experience he can be good but it epends on his training as he could easily end up like Timmy if he gets lazy. I’m not saying Fedor would guarantee lose two fights or any for that matter I’m saying I think he would lose two fights but he can compete with anyone.
"Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth - Mike Tyson
NOG for one the best fighter Fedor has faced to date
Hell Couture beat Timmy and Timmy beat AA pretty simple math there. Rogers is unknown but probally the best figther Fedor has faced to date. Besides that Fedor has fought many LHW and some think he should of lost to Arona back in the day but regardless that was then this is now and Rogers is the best Current day fighter he has beat. Werdum will prove nothing either as far as the best. Infact if you look at Cain and Mir both KO NOG the best fighter Fedor has faced and something Fedor couldn’t even do himself. Of coarse the mid 30 NOG was not himself LOL.
"Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth - Mike Tyson
Come on
MMA math now? We’re just talking about who these fighters (Fedor included) have fought that would give some indication as to who might win these imaginary fights. In my opinion, Mir would crumble to Fedor’s speed and raw strength. Not to mention his punching power. Fedor’s chin has always been top notch and doesn’t seem to slipping yet (although it will most likely happen one day), so I don’t think Mir, or even JDS will KO/TKO him. Brock wouldn’t be able to control Fedor much, even though Fedor can get taken down. However, in that case, Fedor lives by getting the sub die trying. Not saying he gets all the time when he tries (most of the time he does though), but he will at least get Brock off of him. Then Fedor will probably get on top and it’ll be over for Brock or a long night of getting really GnP’ed. Cain, well, I don’t see Cain controlling Fedor much at all. Good wrestler and very fast (the only one possibly faster than Fedor on this list), but I still don’t think he’d have the power to hurt Fedor too much. Also, Fedor will not be a slow-moving target like Nog was. And we’ve seen what even a decent puncher (Kongo) did to Cain. Carwin, I feel, is also very overrated. Punches with the force of a thousand Gods, but very slow and his wrestling is overrated.
My conclusion: Mir will crumble and so will his ego. JDS will get taken down and beaten or subbed (this one is the biggest question mark for me). Cain will not be able to control Fedor and lose the fight wherever it goes and then get KO’ed—bad. Brock, again, will not able to control Fedor and probably get KO’ed, GnP’ed, or even subbed. And Carwin will get hurt early and often and just be too slow to keep up.
hard for a 'tard
C'mon now...
Brock wouldn’t be able to control Fedor much, even though Fedor can get taken down
What makes you say this? Even though I believe that every one of the fighters named could win against Fedor, the one thing I can say will most likely happen is that Brock will take Fedor down. He has been taken down by far worse wrestlers. I can’t see a way for him to get up. I actually would like to hear how you think he would easily get up, when Mir had zero chance of escaping Brock once he got him down. (in other words, Mir and Fedor have arguably the same strenght from their back)
M-1 SUCKS
The world is a dangerous place to live - not because of the people who are evil but because of the people who don't do anything about it. - Albert Einstein
Not sure of the knock on Couture's wrestling.
In terms of pure wrestling skill and credentials, Randy is still top 5 HW in the world, top 3 at LHW. Fedor is not close to this in pure wrestling terms. While Sambo has roots in greco-roman wrestling and Judo, the translation is more in throws and ground grappling, not scrambling to get up.
I don’t see how your MMA math, which you discount so quickly above, can be taken into account here.
The world is a dangerous place to live - not because of the people who are evil but because of the people who don't do anything about it. - Albert Einstein
Oh I forgot...
M-1 SUCKS
The world is a dangerous place to live - not because of the people who are evil but because of the people who don't do anything about it. - Albert Einstein
LOL
@ Couture as top 5 anything. The last time he was top 5 in any class he beat Chuck Liddell
Gimme 1 round!
by ItBurnzWhenIP on Mar 23, 2010 9:30 AM EDT up reply actions
Name 5 HWY and 3 LHW's that have better wrestling than Couture smart guy.
The world is a dangerous place to live - not because of the people who are evil but because of the people who don't do anything about it. - Albert Einstein
pure wrestling pedigree.
The world is a dangerous place to live - not because of the people who are evil but because of the people who don't do anything about it. - Albert Einstein
Yes
It’s all MMA math to a degree, but I’m applying direct skills here, not saying “Couture beat Timmy and Timmy beat AA.”
Randy is pretty much world class in greco-roman. Yes. However, I would say Randy is not nearly as strong as Brock OR Fedor. Randy did it with technique; technique that is superior to Brock’s. Fedor has shown he can get up and out of bad situation with strength and will alone. He just does. He always does. And besides, say what you want about it, but sambo has a good mixture of just about everything to do with MMA, even getting up. Fedor has better hips and core strength than Randy too, yet Randy was able to get out from under big bad Brock. Yet again, this is direct skill comparison, not a ‘this guy would beat this guy cos he beat this’ comparison. And, in the end, who’s to say Fedor would even want to get up with Brock if it went down there? Brock is pretty damn close to completely one-dimensional. His sub defense is still novice at best, despite Mir not being able to do anything in their second fight, as Mir is incredibly overrated. Of course, this all my opinion, but I feel I have to say this again because unless I make sure and point out it’s my opinion, people seem to think I’m calling it fact…? Oh, and M-1 does suck…but I didn’t think anyone claimed that they didn’t..? Maybe you should write them a letter and get that out of your system.
hard for a 'tard
Maybe you should write them a letter and get that out of your system.
wouldn’t help, but all my posts on this thread ended in M-1 SUCKS. this was not directed at you.
Fedor has better hips and core strength than Randy too
Based on what exactly? Fedor has never fought a competent fighter over 260 (Hunt), and the best wrestlers he has fought were Randlemann and Coleman who both fight at 205 now. Please explain how you base this opinion. And please use something better than “He just does”
Fedor has shown he can get up and out of bad situation with strength and will alone. He just does. He always does.
Against guys that are usualyaround 230 pounds. See above.
It’s all MMA math to a degree
Convenient when you need it, isn’t it?
Listen, I like Fedor. He, IMHO, is the best HWY in the world. But I cannot justify automatically writing any of these 5 guys off based upon who Fedor has beaten in the past. The skill sets are better than 5 years ago when Fedor was steamrolling everybody in Pride. That fact that I will probably not see these fights is what pisses me off the most.
The world is a dangerous place to live - not because of the people who are evil but because of the people who don't do anything about it. - Albert Einstein
Yeah me too
Times change and thats a fact, the question we will most likely never know is how will Fedor against todays best HW fighters? To me I don’t think M1 wants to find out unless they get a payment from the UFC that will = ten of SF’s payments.
"Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth - Mike Tyson
I’m basing it on actually watching these fights. What do you base your opinions on? After all, you say Couture is top 5 in the world still. Just what is that based on? His hips. This means he can get out of bad situations without a back against the fence crawl-up method. A sweep. a reversal. A submission. Couture doesn’t do that. He didn’t do that against Brock, and he got swept against Nog. Fedor also goes for, and gets, armbars from the bottom. He does this to fighters and then know it’s coming. He also does this very fast; faster than Couture really does anything. Again, this is something Couture cannot do. Oh, and swept Nog—a prime Nog, actually. He’s also extremely better in the clinch with throws and reversals. Hips. There.
Who’s writing these 5 off (okay, I write off Mir, but he’s shit. His bubble will get burst once again via Carwin or Lesnar or whomever soon enough)? I just think Fedor would beat them based upon watching him fight and them fight. Simple. Despite this new breed of HW everyone goes on and on about, I still feel Fedor is pretty much on his own level. You have your opinion, and I have mine. Although, arguing with you, I’m not sure what your opinion is besides M-1 sucks. we can certainly agree on that.
hard for a 'tard
You said...
Mir will crumble and so will his ego. JDS will get taken down and beaten or subbed (this one is the biggest question mark for me). Cain will not be able to control Fedor and lose the fight wherever it goes and then get KO’ed—bad. Brock, again, will not able to control Fedor and probably get KO’ed, GnP’ed, or even subbed. And Carwin will get hurt early and often and just be too slow to keep up.
That means writing them off, other than JDS, who is only a question mark. and I said…
In terms of pure wrestling skill and credentials, Randy is still top 5 HW in the world, top 3 at LHW.
How is that top 5 in the division? Are wrestlers the best in the division? I stand by the fact that he is, AS A WRESTLER, top 5 hwy and top 3 LHW. Don’t distort shit.
My argument is: you wrote off the 5 fighters above based upon opponents that do not match either the skill set or size of the current HWY’s in the UFC. Pay attention.
The world is a dangerous place to live - not because of the people who are evil but because of the people who don't do anything about it. - Albert Einstein
So, what’s your definition of “writing off?” I say Fedor will beat them. I am in no way guaranteeing this. I just think he would beat them if they were to fight in the foreseeable future—which they won’t. So, that means I’m writing them off? So then by that definition you’re writing off Fedor? I guess our definition of that is different then. And JDS is the biggest question mark out of the 5 because I believe he is the best natural fighter out of them all.
As far as distorting things, you’re right. I had to re-read back some, but I missed the first part of the comment about Randy being top 5 as far as in pure wrestling credentials.
hard for a 'tard
Now we are talking.
You gave no wiggle room for any of them winning, originally. Sorry if I mistook what you said too seriously. Based upon your arguments, you seem to worship from the alter of Fedor. I do not, but do think he is the best HWY in the world as I said above. I also believe that all of the above could beat him. Doesn’t mean they will.
The world is a dangerous place to live - not because of the people who are evil but because of the people who don't do anything about it. - Albert Einstein
mma math is all we got I guess.
Til Fedor signs on the dotted line
If Russia attacked Turkey from the rear, Do you think Greece would help?
There is no guarantee on any opinion because they are exactly that LEE a opinion
All we have is common opponents and to really gauge some of the fighters by and by Fedors biggest victories others have caught up to him as far as calibure of fighter they have beat. As NOG has been Fedors claim to #1 status for way to long in my opinion. Werdum would prove nothing as far as being #1 either, don’t get me wrong Werdum is a solid fighter but not elite and like I stated before a smaller weaker version of Mir.
"Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth - Mike Tyson
Of course
This is all opinions and speculation. That goes without really saying. Werdum wouldn’t prove much at all, I completely agree. I never said Fedor is fighting the best right now. I mean he’s in Strikeforce. I still feel he’s the best though. And yes, Werdum is basically a smaller, weaker version of Mir—however, his BJJ and grappling is leaps and bounds about Mir’s, no matter what Mir or Dana might say.
hard for a 'tard
Mir MMA wise is just as good if not better grappling with MMA rules
As far as ADCC or any Jj championships go you could be right another couple fighters that have done well in ADCC is Monson and GG both have been near the top and GG won another tournament but in MMA there grappling is good but not great.
"Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth - Mike Tyson
Eh
Just who has Mir subbed in MMA to prove he’s better than Werdum in submissions and grappling? Timmy? Pete freaking Williams? An extremely green Brock? Meanwhile, Werdum has at the very least subbed Overeem and Aleksander. Seeing most of both of their fights, I just do not see how Mir is close to Werdum in this department.
hard for a 'tard
Tim and Overeem would be a decent fight
But really Overeem has beat nobody in the top tier of the HW division, Infact when Werdum submitted him Overeem was a LHW fighter and much smaller he was submitted by arona shortly after too so big deal, and Aleksander may have a famous last name but that proves nothing. Infact I would say Timmy would of of been 265 and Overeem would of been 210ish and at the time timmy’s JJ was just as good as Overeems. Some bad examples there but good try.
"Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth - Mike Tyson
Bad examples?
No one is claiming Overeem isn’t overrated. I agree he hasn’t beaten hardly anyone worth note in HW, but his ground game isn’t terrible. I would say it’s better than Tim’s and certainly better than Williams’. And Overeem was a LHW then and I feel a better fighter. And, yes, Arona did sub him. Although Arona doesn’t have many subs on his record, he was a beast and does have a very good ground game and great control; he just usually goes to boring decisions or KO’s people/gets KO’ed. And Aleksander might have a couple losses, but his ground game is very good as well. He’s a decorated sambo practitioner for shit’s sake. It’s not as though he’s a fish-out-of-water on the ground or hasn’t subbed anyone. So how are these examples so bad again?? Again, Mir’s best submission win was against Traven, would proven to be a crap fighter.
hard for a 'tard
Jeff Monson was a ADCC world champion and in 2005
beat out Werdum and GG to be crowned the champion, but in MMA on the ground could do nothing to big Timmy in a five round fight that many times were spent on the ground if you can remember, and Big Timmy dominated him in the grapple for the most part yet Mir had little problems subbing big Timmy. Like I said just because they are elite Jj artist doesn’t make them elite grapplers in MMA. The best grapplers for the most part in MMA are those with wrestling back grounds and the reason Mir is better at MMA grappling is because he has the size and strength to compete against these guys along with his Jj knowlege. When you go back on his career he always had potential but he was a lazy drunk, but unlike big Timmy got his shit together and now is living up to his potential finally. But none of these fighters we are talking about are the best grapplers in MMA but Mir has the knowlege, size and strength to tap anybody if he gets a hold of you were Werdum has the ability but will be over powered by the larger fighters as you could see by his last fight agaisnt a very unproven Big Foot he had troubles strength wise, but had opportunities if Bigfoot was a wrestler Werdum would of been on his back all night.
"Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth - Mike Tyson
I’m not sure what Jeff Monson has to do with Werdum vs. Mir in MMA BJJ/grappling. I understand and agree with your point about some accomplished JJ practitioners not being good at bringing that to MMA; Monson is one of them! haha So, I don’t get how using Monson as gauge for Tim’s ground game can be used here to talk about Mir vs. werdum, considering Monson has never been that good of a MMA fighter..?
In the end, Werdum has more impressive submissions over better ground fighters than Mir. Hell, Werdum has more KO’s than Mir as well. Interesting…
And I like how people talk about Mir’s newfound strength now as if it’s been proven in a fight at all. He surprised Kongo and a sickly Nog (although we now find out that Nog just isn’t what he once was anyway). So he lifts weights the right way for MMA preparation now/ he’s still the same Mir that’ll get destroyed by Lesnar yet again the same way. Lifting weights won’t give him better sweeps, hips, chin, or heart. I’m not a fan of either, but I hope Mir beats Carwin so we can see Brock beat him once again.
hard for a 'tard
Who did Werdum beat that is better than NOG
Hell the best fighter Werdum has beat is GG. He hasn’t even faced a top five HW yet. Him and Kongo would be a great match I’ll give him that.
And I’m not even talking about the 265# Mir I was talking about the 255 pound Mir that is bigger and stronger than Werdum. Mir has always had skill anybody that new anything about MMA understood his potential but his heart was always questioned. Lesnar would smash Werdum, can you imagine little 240# Werdum under big Brock!! Talk about no chance.
But with saying that I’m cheering for Carwin I think he’s the real deal he just need to prove it.
"Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth - Mike Tyson
Whether I agree with you or not
It would be nice to Carwin KO an overzealous Mir on the feet. It would make my night/week/month/year.
hard for a 'tard
yeah personally I just want to see someone other than Mir face Brock
"Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth - Mike Tyson
the fight with lindland was a joke. lindland is a natural middlewieght or lhwt and he even
got one good shot in that bloodied up the great fedor in front of vladmir putin no less.
I'm all about covering the spread and moneylines. I was building a house, I don't deserve this, deserves have nothing to do with it. Bang. "Unforgiven" I drink your milkshake. I drink it up! "There Will BE Blood"
by wolfmanshowlforever on Mar 23, 2010 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions
"could beat" should be in the title
Fedor still gets no respect, tsk tsk.
Tito interviewing Babalu: "I want to tell me what you see, let's go ahead and see by the fight, what you saw, in the ring."
Tito interviewing Fedor: "Let me tell you how you feeling right now?"
Anyone has a chance to beat anyone...
but I don’t see it happening. I think JDS has the striking to pose a threat but we all know about Fedor’s ground game and he’s no slouch on the feet.
Anderson Silva is p4p the greatest fighter of all time, Fedor and GSP fear the mighty Spider
I would love to see those fights
I would pretty much guarantee Fedor would lose at least one but if I have to pick a numbe I would say 2 out of the five.
"Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth - Mike Tyson
Times change and the fighters evolve obvious to anyone that has watched MMA over the years
To say Fedor has faced any of the best fighters NOW is naive besides rogers who has very little MMA anything background but has he size and decent athletisim of a big man to give Fedor a challenge. imagine what someone with Rogers size that has a background in wrestling wcould do with Rogers size? you can never count Fedor or for that matter truely predict any fight with 100% accuracy but as times have change so do opinions. To be the best you have to face the best and in my opinion the large majority is in the UFC.
"Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth - Mike Tyson
Ok.
Something that many of you don’t understand about fighters it seems. All the athleticism in the world means jack shit if they have a glass jaw.
Gonzaga – Glass jaw, tin-foil heart
Carwin – Glass jaw
Lesnar – Hasn’t been fully beared out but he was hurt by Mir on a glancing blow, quite possibly has a weak chin
Valasquez – Glass jaw. Almost knocked out 3 times by sorry ass Kongo
JDS – solid chin, devastating power, solid defensively – The best of any of the above.
Gimme 1 round!
by ItBurnzWhenIP on Mar 23, 2010 9:34 AM EDT up reply actions
LOL Mir caught Brock square in the jaw then with a knee to the face
And he didn’t drop, Carwin glass jaw how so? He’s never lost I’m going to stop there because now that I think of it this is a pretty retarded statement I’m responding to. Itburnz you have no clue man, be cool stay in school.
"Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth - Mike Tyson
brock,carwin,jds
mir has a chance as does cain but i doubt it, carwin and brock would make fedor look like a lhw and throw him around like an effing ragdoll and pound him out like rogers tried, and jds would put on a clinic of striking
i dont know if cain could because he doesnt exactly have the size of brock or carwin, and idk how his sub defense is i would imagine good, but kongo rocked him a lot so a fedor haymaker would end it
What makes you think he can be controlled like that though.
Rogers had about 5o lbs. obn him and Fedor tossed fim to the ground like it was nothing really.
look at how randy was able to nuetralize brock in the clinch, brock didnt throw him around at all.
Loyality before Reality
rogers had fedor up against the cage for at least 30 seconds. he was either not savvy enough or...
too scared to take any chances against fedor. that would not happen if brock lesnar fought him. he would just put him in the corner of the cage and get him in the same position he had mir and he would make fedor’s face look worse than sanchez and torres put together. jds i think could outstrike him. mir could be interesting to see who would get the ankle lock first. cain might be able to take him down to the ground and gnp him for a tko. every day that goes by i believe fedor becomes more irrelevant to the heavyweight division. until he proves he could beat a current ufc champion he is a non factor imo. i think i saw somewhere that he will be fighting some japanese heavyweight in japan
I'm all about covering the spread and moneylines. I was building a house, I don't deserve this, deserves have nothing to do with it. Bang. "Unforgiven" I drink your milkshake. I drink it up! "There Will BE Blood"
by wolfmanshowlforever on Mar 22, 2010 12:00 PM EDT up reply actions
relevant? non-factor?
quit using these empty terms, of course hes relevant, He is fighting and he will always be a factor as the number 1 consenus HW fighter.
I know this is all conjecture from you and i shouldnt get pissed but theres no way of knowing what brock would do to him.
but if theres one thing that history tells us its that Fedor wins fights.
and I hope he doesnt take that fight in japan
Loyality before Reality
^^^^^THIS^^^^^
And I am one of the biggest Fedor doubters that is out there. Fedor deserves his due regardess of not being in the UFC. The man wins fights. PERIOD.
M-1 SUCKS.
The world is a dangerous place to live - not because of the people who are evil but because of the people who don't do anything about it. - Albert Einstein
fedor stats. 5 feet 11 inches tall and weighs 238.
he was carrying around a lot of belly fat in his last fight. if any of these fights do happen it would probably be 18 months from now. i would say he would be 245 pounds of belly fat. the paradigm has shifted for the heavyweights in the ufc. it was a weak diivision when sylvia and arlovoski traded places. now the ufc has four guys who could take on fedor and beat him. his mangement nows that too and that is why he is even avoiding a fight with werdum. fedor was a great champion. he is no longer that in my eyes.
I'm all about covering the spread and moneylines. I was building a house, I don't deserve this, deserves have nothing to do with it. Bang. "Unforgiven" I drink your milkshake. I drink it up! "There Will BE Blood"
by wolfmanshowlforever on Mar 23, 2010 3:41 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah I think the wins over NOG and CC even though they may of been in there prime prove nothing now days
Rogers was a big win but even if he does fight Werdum, Werdum is a smaller less powerfull version of Mir. It’s clear the best HW are in the UFC too bad Fedor has M1 as a management then we would see all the best.
"Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth - Mike Tyson
Mir???????? who is this lol
In another post i thought you said Brock hasnt beat anyone yet worth a crap! Now Mir is good enough to beat Fedor?!? And i did notice that you have him as a fav fighter. Now i know that both of you post lol :)
Open up the Shit Gates and God Bless Marv
All could beat Fedor
Best chance(s) in order:
1. Brock
2. Mir
3. Carwin
4. JDS
5. Cain
He’s never fought anyone like Brock, and I would be willing to bet that Brock would pull out the win. Not as sold on the other guys, but I think all are capable of beating him.
yeh all (could) beat him
but would they ? im not sure. I hope we get to find out soon though
Open up the Shit Gates and God Bless Marv
All of them would be a challenge for Fedor, but JDS would pose the biggest problem. He has great hands and the way he popped back us as GG tried to take him down was impressive. Brock would be next because of his size and wrestling, tho he is inexperienced. Then Carwin because of one punch KO power.
Think Fedor could handle Mir. He would avoid his strikes and def. not get subbed by Mir. Think Cain is pretty solid all around, but Fedor would have an answer for him.
I would take JDS over anyone right now ,including Fedor and Brock
All those guys have a chance to beat him except for maybe carwin. We will see what carwin is made of after his fight with frank the legend mir, I personally think mir will handle carwin rather easily. There is a new breed of hw fighter and fedor has fought none of them because none of them are in strikeforce. I hope fedor pulls m1’s dick out of his ass and signs with ufc to fight in the real mma hw division because personally I dont think he would do very well.
Someone give Cain some love!
After Brock, I pick Cain as having the best chance. Didn’t anyone see his last 3 fights, and how much he’s improved?
Cain vs. Mir is a fight I’m looking forward to down the line. He’d be way too fast and ferocious on the feet, and wouldn’t let Mir take it to the ground if he didn’t want to. Mir would have nothing for him at all.
i'll give cain velasquez a great chance at beating the last emporer.
he is another one of those fighters who gets better with each fight. kinda like stefan struve has been doing. if struve comes in weighing about 245 instead of 238 i ’ll give him a 50/50 chance of beating roy nelson.
I'm all about covering the spread and moneylines. I was building a house, I don't deserve this, deserves have nothing to do with it. Bang. "Unforgiven" I drink your milkshake. I drink it up! "There Will BE Blood"
by wolfmanshowlforever on Mar 23, 2010 5:52 PM EDT up reply actions
jds is starting to look like a legitimate top 5 threat to lesnar or fedor...
I get my ass kicked for money, all you gotta do is talk motherfucker.... Rampage Pride GP03
Yeah good KO gif , I liked Carwins a little better
"Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth - Mike Tyson
lets go oldschool
I get my ass kicked for money, all you gotta do is talk motherfucker.... Rampage Pride GP03
by DrewMoney$$$ on Mar 22, 2010 7:34 PM EDT up reply actions
exactly what carwin would do to fedor.
I'm all about covering the spread and moneylines. I was building a house, I don't deserve this, deserves have nothing to do with it. Bang. "Unforgiven" I drink your milkshake. I drink it up! "There Will BE Blood"
by wolfmanshowlforever on Mar 23, 2010 5:54 PM EDT up reply actions
ok last one....
I get my ass kicked for money, all you gotta do is talk motherfucker.... Rampage Pride GP03
LMFAO!
Awesome gif. Blood on the screen is priceless!
The world is a dangerous place to live - not because of the people who are evil but because of the people who don't do anything about it. - Albert Einstein
everybody has a plan until a 285 pound man has got you in the crucifix position and beats you down.
I'm all about covering the spread and moneylines. I was building a house, I don't deserve this, deserves have nothing to do with it. Bang. "Unforgiven" I drink your milkshake. I drink it up! "There Will BE Blood"
by wolfmanshowlforever on Mar 23, 2010 3:45 PM EDT up reply actions
great saying man, I might have to change my sig LOL
"Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth - Mike Tyson
mike tyso is a generation ago. have you heard he has a pigeon show on animal planet
and i’m not kidding you. mike tyson does raise pigeons on nyc rooftops when he was an up and comer. now he has a show about it.
I'm all about covering the spread and moneylines. I was building a house, I don't deserve this, deserves have nothing to do with it. Bang. "Unforgiven" I drink your milkshake. I drink it up! "There Will BE Blood"
by wolfmanshowlforever on Mar 23, 2010 4:02 PM EDT up reply actions
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