Victimized by poor judging? 'Sucks to be you... '
by Jesse Holland on Nov 29, 2010 1:15 PM EST
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Says UFC Hall-of-Famer Randy Couture:
"[Judges] see some superficial things like Rampage moving forward the whole time in that fight and they attribute that to him winning those rounds. And technically that's not what was happening. It sucks to be a fighter and have that happen to you ... I think it's a huge issue. It's a lot different than judging boxing and unfortunately a lot of judges transferred over. They don't understand a lot of the intricacies of our sport. Who's controlling the tempo of the fight. Who's actually technically scoring ... Unfortunately guys like (Cecil) Peoples, and some of these guys have been around for a long time, (you'd) think they'd have figured it out by now. I think there has to be some sort of education or certification program for these judges to get them up to speed on the criteria and what they're looking at to the judge these fights."
"Naytch" (via Cagewriter) is the latest high-profile mixed martial arts figure to speak out against the inconsistent and haphazard judging that has led to so many head-scratching decisions over the past couple of years. Quinton Jackson's win at UFC 123: "Rampage vs. Machida" continues to be scrutinized but as Couture illustrates, the people in place still haven't "figured it out." How bad does it have to get before UFC fighters (and fans) see a major reform?
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…things like Rampage moving forward the whole time in that fight and they attribute that to him winning those rounds. And technically that’s not what was happening.
Yeah.. except it was exactly what was happening.
Yeah.. except it was exactly what was happening.The judges need an overhaul for sure, but this is a ridiculous example you use, Mr. Couture.
"Why am I here? Why does my mind have wings? Why do blue midgets hit me with fish?!" - The Tick
Moving forward does not equal winning the fight.
Just like being in top position does not automatically mean you are winning the fight. That is what he means and that is the problem with these idiot judges.
+1
I think it’s important to hear this from fighters too, especially ones who win the fight. I thought Rampage questioning the decision (even though I can’t stand him) was a great thing to do, because he knew in his heart that he didn’t win the fight. Same with Josh Thomson against JZ, when you have fighters acknowldege receiving favorable decisions it shows the system needs to be adjusted.
"Before I do anything I ask myself, "Would an idiot do that?" And if the answer is yes, I do not do that thing." - Dwight Schrute
This coming from the inventor of wall n stall.....
How many rounds has he won because these morons couldn’t tell what he was doing. But i’ll leave the couture bashing for some other time. The more important topic is that Peoples as big as an idiot he is, has become the scapegoat for all judging. If a scorecard is fucked up everyone just says – was Cecil judging? Cecil is only one in a massive army of incompetency. There are so many more worse and atrocious judges out there who don’t ever catch any flack for their shit because it all gets pile onto Peoples. It’s not the criteria or the must system or anything that’s fucked up. It’s incompetent judges who were too shitty for boxing being thrown at MMA. Commissions need to do their jobs and institute mandatory training for all judges like McCarthy’s or Herb’s schools. Follow what Nick Lembo is doing for New Jersey instead of being a limp dick assholes who refuses to do anything like Nevada or California.
BIG NOG for Life
One Step closer to Gleison Tibau @ 145
If the round is too close, it's 10-10, NOT flip a coin 10-9 or late takedown FTW.
by NNR (formerly NameNotRequired) on Nov 29, 2010 2:34 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Good post, but IMO Cecil gets the blunt of it bc he is usually the judge that has the opposite of the other two.
It’s funny bc you can have a 30-27 30-27 29-28 split decision and it’s always cecil with the 29-28! I wonder how much the judges speak. Like, do you think after the fight the other two look at him and say, “what the fuck were you watching???”
Anderson Silva is by far the number one P4P king!!! Even when he is losing a fight he still comes back and finishes for the win! GSP dominates the whole fight and still can't finish! LOL
I know you were joking
but don’t all 3 judges sit apart from each other and at different angles of the ring/cage? It is entirely possible to have 1judge differ from the others in that situation.
by Swedish Chef smerdy herdy verdy on Nov 29, 2010 3:38 PM EST up reply actions
I have no idea how they arranged.
Anderson Silva is by far the number one P4P king!!! Even when he is losing a fight he still comes back and finishes for the win! GSP dominates the whole fight and still can't finish! LOL
hahahahaha
So much fail in such a short clip. Across teh cage from the fighters, late stoppage, and completely missed the tackle. Awesome job, Cecil!
"Why am I here? Why does my mind have wings? Why do blue midgets hit me with fish?!" - The Tick
ahahahhaha lollerskates
Fights aren't fought by keyboard warriors, they are fought by true champions like danago.
by theoregonduck on Nov 29, 2010 7:25 PM EST up reply actions
Moving forward does not equal winning the fight.
Right, just as backing up doesn’t equal winning the fight. Rampage got the better of the exchanges in the first two rounds, Machida in the third. Randy using this fight as an example, with so many real robberies out there, is ludicrous.
"Why am I here? Why does my mind have wings? Why do blue midgets hit me with fish?!" - The Tick
No rampage did not ...i repeat did not get the better of the exchanges.
All statistics out there show that Machida landed more than Rampage. I personally didn’t award either of them rounds 1 and 2 as neither had any meaningful offense. Third round was the decider for a 30-29 card IMO.
BIG NOG for Life
One Step closer to Gleison Tibau @ 145
If the round is too close, it's 10-10, NOT flip a coin 10-9 or late takedown FTW.
by NNR (formerly NameNotRequired) on Nov 29, 2010 4:32 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I gotta agree, fuck the first 2 rounds, who cares who won them?
the most damage was done by Machida, but still, I dont care that he lost… he should have done way more in that fight and so should have Rampage, that shit was almost as boring as CC/Mir… shoulda sent a damn lion into the cage like they did in the Roman days… that said, neither guy should be complaining about the decision, because neither of them really went after it at any point
by xquisitewretch on Nov 29, 2010 4:45 PM EST up reply actions
In the first round...
Machida landed leg kicks while Rampage’s punches hit Machida’s arms… that is NOT a round won just because he was moving forward. That’s their styles… even in boxing Ali moved backwards so there’s no excuse for judges screwing this up. It’s like having top position that gives wrestlers and advantage and BJJ guys a disadvantage. Cage control my ass, if a guy lies on top of you that is NOT winning the fight. Bas Rutten said if you take a guy down and don’t do anything with it then it should count against him. I like that idea cause in some cases somebody is losing the fight and take down to avoid the fight but jsut ay there.
An injured Anderson Silva managed to finish a cheating Sonnen who failed his drug test but GSP can't finish a natural WW who isn't a dinosaur and won't take a fight at an above weight class. Let's not kid ourselves about who the real P4P king is!
laying on top of someone without doing anything is like breaking up a clinch which is done many times in fights.
Robbie Savage
I don't know about that.
What if Rampage had clinched with Machida more just to keep him from running away? That would mean clinching was used to cause a fight as opposed to avoid one.
I love tandem cycling. I win whether I'm in front or in back.
All statistics out there show that Machida landed more than Rampage.
Wrong. http://blog.fightmetric.com/2010/11/rampage-vs-machida-fightmetric-report.html
Total Strikes per Round:
Round 1: Rampage 26, Machida 16
Round 2: Rampage 28, Machida 11
Round 3: Rampage 16, Machida 26
You can repeat all you want, it doesn’t change reality.
"Why am I here? Why does my mind have wings? Why do blue midgets hit me with fish?!" - The Tick
metric counts all the fluke arm shots and what not. those are off. almost half of pages shots are to the body and the majority of those werer to the arm.
I do a lot of jacking off, ya know, because I don’t get no women, so these arms are, like, humongously big. See it’s workout, and it’s pleasure.._" Charles Bennett
"He who fights and runs away lives to fight another day and looks like a ***** today." -Tank Abbott.
Read what I'm replying to.
"Why am I here? Why does my mind have wings? Why do blue midgets hit me with fish?!" - The Tick
The key stat in that is Significant Strikes.
You are right though Rampage did lead in missed head strikes that connected to the body.
No lol
Signifigant strikes is a silly stat.
"Why am I here? Why does my mind have wings? Why do blue midgets hit me with fish?!" - The Tick
i will admit i was referring to significant strikes. If you don't believe it
because fight metric still counts those knee strikes to the thighs in the clinch as such for example. Gotta use all the functionalities of the report myth. If you click the radio button for “striking distance” toward the top – aka when rampage was walking him down (which is the criteria most seem to point to as he was doing more and exchanging better) Machida has 10 strikes to Rampage’s 3. In round 2 it was 6 for machida and 1 for Rampage. I think those are the most poignant and damaging shots. Unless you want to argue that the two inch knee to the thighs from Rampage should give him the rounds. But as i mentioned i refuse to squabble over two more punches but one less kick type of arguments. Much better to say no one won if you ask me.
BIG NOG for Life
One Step closer to Gleison Tibau @ 145
If the round is too close, it's 10-10, NOT flip a coin 10-9 or late takedown FTW.
by NNR (formerly NameNotRequired) on Nov 29, 2010 11:42 PM EST up reply actions
seriously...
how do you expect to win a fight when youre backing up all 3 rounds and you throw 60 strikes? both of these clowns lost imo but nobody should be crying “robbery” neither one really did anything
by xquisitewretch on Nov 29, 2010 1:28 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
+1 xquisitewretch
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eh
Rampage himself felt he lost the fight. That in itself should tell you it was a very, very close fight.
We fight, get beat, rise and fight again.
he's used to Pride.
he would’ve lost if it was Pride.
Using no way as way, having no limitation as limitation.
i believe his explanation was valid
he lost the 3rd, in the moment all he could remember was getting his ass kicked for the last 5 min. he said he had to go back and watch the fight. He corrected himself and I think both instances were quite stand up of him.
As far as saying that because some of these judges are coming over from boxing it means they can’t see all the “intricacies” of the sport is bull. I’ll admit the judging in a lot of these fights is horrid. But even in boxing, Floyd moves backwards, Marquez moves backwards….and they win fights. Because in moving backwards they are still working their offense. They’re still throwing punches and/or their defensive is so evident that you can’t make a case against it. In the case pointed out, Machida didn’t. He was moving backwards and from time to time throwing some strikes. Rampage did more in the first and second than “JUST MOVE FORWARD” and that’s what won him the fight. I’m not saying it was an amazing first and second but I think it was clearly enough to win the rounds.
the standup game is pretty straight up. You move, you punch, you either get hit or you make them miss. Simply put. The judges, just like in boxing, shouldn’t be judging on how technically proficient the strikes are. The place where the judges need so much more help is in the clinch or on the ground. Those areas are not black and white and its evident that they are truly lacking education.
"You can’t make everyone happy no matter what. All I can do is live my life and try to be successful and please myself. I have my own morals I live by. Bill Cosby once said, ‘I don’t know the key to success but the key to failure is trying to please everybody.’ I agree with that. I live my life my way. I try to do the right thing, but I know there are going to be people who aren’t happy with what I do or say no matter what, so I’m not going to worry about it." - BJ PENN
Hey xquisitewretch
What are the terms for our sig bet?
One month sig and pic?
"I pity any fool that dares to stand toe to toe with Rampage"
Fuck this shit
I’m tired of controversial decisions. No time limit on any fight should be established and to win you must finish your opponent (not sexually) but actually finish him!
Midgets don't have feelings right?
by G-Rated on Nov 29, 2010 2:08 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
does he have to stop breathing too? in all seriousness a machida fight would last for days and kalib starnes would still be running now
by Burlzilla129 on Nov 29, 2010 2:20 PM EST up reply actions
YES.
Midgets don't have feelings right?
by G-Rated on Nov 29, 2010 2:33 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
It’s a good thing you put the ‘not sexually’ disclaimer in there, because for a minute I thought you were advocating simultaneous hand jobs, with whoever causes the other guy to finish first getting the win.
Our lives change like the weather, but a legend never dies.
yeah, i was so confused too.
thanks for sayin “not sexually”, that totally cleared up the confusion.
Using no way as way, having no limitation as limitation.
no problem
I put that mostly for dragon
Midgets don't have feelings right?
by G-Rated on Nov 29, 2010 2:44 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
this coming from the guy who "beat" vera. hold people against the cage and some how get a decision "win"
by Burlzilla129 on Nov 29, 2010 1:26 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Beat me to it matey
Randy knows the ‘technicalities’ the judges are looking for in a decision win….
Can’t believe people are still banging on about this fight. It was close but it was a fair result. Lessons learned…. move on
A burning passion from a burning mass reaches up for the sky
by Shoguns Hairy Forearms. on Nov 29, 2010 1:52 PM EST up reply actions
It's good though
To see fighters call out bad judges by name. I’d love to see a fighter after losing a fight to say Cecil peoplesis an idiot and doesn’t know crap when Rogan put the microphone in his face
by soupdz28 on Nov 29, 2010 1:26 PM EST via mobile reply actions
I think there has to be some sort of education or certification program for these judges to get them up to speed on the criteria and what they’re looking at to the judge these fights
Don’t all the commissions set their own standards for certification? I know Nevada has a certification test, but am unsure what kind of training they actually do. Anyone?
We fight, get beat, rise and fight again.
where do we sign up.
i’ll be an mma judge. travelling the country watchin free mma shows.
your clothes. give them to me. now.
+1
i hear that….old ass dudes judging fights, dont even know who’s who. waste of good seats and view
God is too big for just one religion...
by jason*bourne on Nov 29, 2010 1:31 PM EST up reply actions
you would be working for the commission
in a particular city. They aren’t employed by the UFC. The UFC has to use the judges allocated by the athletic commission in whatever area they are holding the event in. .
We fight, get beat, rise and fight again.
no more decisions..that never happens in real fights
either go with crowd response or have those voting remotes—americas funniest home videos
if the fight doesnt get finished, fighters dont get paid or get paid waaaay less. that’ll make them take more chances…i dont think rioheroes has decsions, does it?
God is too big for just one religion...
I hope your not serious about fan-voting.
but id like to see a “finish-bonus”. And I’d like the judges to show the scores inbetween rounds.
Using no way as way, having no limitation as limitation.
partly okay
I like the lowering of the purse for a non finish.
Or…all fights that aren’t finishes are draws. Martial Arts is based on two samurai fighting. Could you imagine them stopping after 15 minutes, and asking some passerby’s who won the fight?
"I pity any fool that dares to stand toe to toe with Rampage"
rules and regulations
you need time restraints. it’s a regulated sport now.
Using no way as way, having no limitation as limitation.
of course...
But if the time runs out there is now “winner” of the fight…isn’t it a draw. What if the guy “losing” would have gotten a KO in the 16th minute? The rounds and duration are arbitrary.
Draw.
"I pity any fool that dares to stand toe to toe with Rampage"
I disagree.
I think there should be more rounds scored 10-10 (and 10-8) and thus more draws overall, but completely disagree that any fight that isn’t finished should be a draw. I think that would lead to much less exciting fights where one fighter tries to survive and earn a draw when he knows he’s outmatched. I also think that some decision victories are just as decisive as finishes. In GSP-Fitch there may not have been a finish, but Fitch damn sure knew he had lost a fight.
"Before I do anything I ask myself, "Would an idiot do that?" And if the answer is yes, I do not do that thing." - Dwight Schrute
I love it StrikerDave taking a page out of ZST.
No ringside judges…all fights that go to decisions = Draw and the best part: Title Fights = Unlimited Rounds, No Draw, No Sudden Death….someone will lose TKO, Sub or Drop dead from exhaustion.
BIG NOG for Life
One Step closer to Gleison Tibau @ 145
If the round is too close, it's 10-10, NOT flip a coin 10-9 or late takedown FTW.
by NNR (formerly NameNotRequired) on Nov 29, 2010 2:46 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I agree with both...
More 10-10 rounds and
Title fights are infinite time.
"I pity any fool that dares to stand toe to toe with Rampage"
Retarded idea
I hope you guys are joking.
I love tandem cycling. I win whether I'm in front or in back.
Yeah, because I love it when people stop fighting and ask for someone else's opinion of who won.
It’s great. Or not.
Why not have a an epic fight for all title fights. You have to take the title. Not just have someone else say you “earned” it.
Don’t even get me started on what I think about ref’s standing up fighters mid round…WTF? If the guy on the ground can’t up too f’n bad. “But the fights are boooooring if they don’t stand them up” . So was Mir/Crocop but I don;t think they should have introduced a folding chair into the cage in order to make it more exciting. I think they should purify the sport and eliminate stand ups. oops…I got started on my own.
"I pity any fool that dares to stand toe to toe with Rampage"
Under this plan the Edgar-Maynard fight will last for freaking ever. Edgar’s pitter-patter won’t finish anyone, and neither will the Lay n Gray.
Our lives change like the weather, but a legend never dies.
I imagine Maynard gasses and Frankie Jumps on his
neck and finishes him. In fact that’s how he’ll beat him this time. RNC off a scramble after he buzzes him with a crisp punch.
BIG NOG for Life
One Step closer to Gleison Tibau @ 145
If the round is too close, it's 10-10, NOT flip a coin 10-9 or late takedown FTW.
by NNR (formerly NameNotRequired) on Nov 29, 2010 4:57 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I've got Frankie in that one, too.
He’s the third man in my marathon Condit-Cain-Edgar parlay. I don’t think Gray has the cardio to get through 5 fast paced rounds and I don’t see Frankie allowing himself to be smothered the whole time.
"Before I do anything I ask myself, "Would an idiot do that?" And if the answer is yes, I do not do that thing." - Dwight Schrute
So...
By this logic, neither fighter has the ability to definitively win the fight. Yet one will walk away with a strap. Maybe I’m old school but I think a championship fighter should be able to…you know… actually win a fight.
"I pity any fool that dares to stand toe to toe with Rampage"
No I actually agree with you. I would much prefer a definitive and unquestioned win. But Edgar and Maynard rely on decisions and have minimal ability to finish. If this fight was on PPV under fight til it’s finished rules, this would have to be the first fight shown, and it would probably be the only fight shown.
Our lives change like the weather, but a legend never dies.
Does the PPV have to have a hard endtime...
I don’t know about you but I cream about the idea of seeing an epic hour long fight for the title.
Instinct, muscle memory, and long term training would take over and we would really see who is the top dog.
I have heard about the EPIC Gracie fights that went on for hours….I would LOVE to see one. Just haven;t found ont o download yet.
"I pity any fool that dares to stand toe to toe with Rampage"
You should stop drinking the bong water.
I love tandem cycling. I win whether I'm in front or in back.
ZOMG TROLL!!!!!
"Why am I here? Why does my mind have wings? Why do blue midgets hit me with fish?!" - The Tick
I don't know what "ZOMG" is.
And I’m not trolling SD.
I love tandem cycling. I win whether I'm in front or in back.
Strikerdave is right.......That's the only thing that drew me to ZST.
Unlimited rounds meant it was probably the closest thing to the valetudo days. i just imagined about guys of the old days, the vale tudo wars between BJJ and Luta Livre where guys either killed each other or layed in guard for literally half a day. Arenas rioting, street fights, the dojo challenges all that nonsense..Those type of matches had their own veneers. You don’t find guys like that anymore….fighters like Rei Zulu and so many unknown tough guys. Maybe we can see if these athletes of today have some of that in them.
BIG NOG for Life
One Step closer to Gleison Tibau @ 145
If the round is too close, it's 10-10, NOT flip a coin 10-9 or late takedown FTW.
by NNR (formerly NameNotRequired) on Nov 29, 2010 11:47 PM EST up reply actions
I would love to see fights go until there is a winner!
I have always said that. Judges don’t determine who won the fight, they decide who was winning up until that point and it’s so subjective! Yea GSP dominates and leaves no question as to who was winning, but IMO, he doesn’t win a fight with a decision. I mean, what choice is there really bc what athletic commision will allow a fight that doesn’t end? Plus we wouldn’t get to see many fights on each PPV. Hell, if GSP was on the card then that would be the only fight we would see.
Anderson Silva is by far the number one P4P king!!! Even when he is losing a fight he still comes back and finishes for the win! GSP dominates the whole fight and still can't finish! LOL
They do have a firm end time. Satellite time for PPVs is sold in 3-hour blocks. I could be wrong, but I don’t think Dana can call the PPV provider and tell them to add an extra hour. If he can it will be costly, and you’ll end up getting a message on the bottom of your screen that says “Want to see the end of this fight? Cough up another $25.”
Our lives change like the weather, but a legend never dies.
Fights need definitive endings
PPV reasons aside, boxing used to have no round limits. For some reason (I think people were dying, but can’t remember off hand) they changed it to set limits.
In a sport, sometimes ya have to deal with the boring with the entertaining. Football has its share of running teams, safe plays, etc.. Winning is what matters.
While I wish every fight was exciting, I don’t want MMA to become what wrestler has become (remember that even pro wrestling was legit at one time).
"Why am I here? Why does my mind have wings? Why do blue midgets hit me with fish?!" - The Tick
He's right..
First off I wish I had the “poor” judges in my/ my teams fights.you should see (and maybe some of you have) the judging in native American events and in small shows you have never hear of. It’s sick. There has to e a national org. To certify refs and judges
by victorymma on Nov 29, 2010 1:39 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Aggression = moving forward Randy! IMO, if you are running away half of the fight then you better do some damn impressive counter striking and Machida did not do enough.
by NateDogg77 on Nov 29, 2010 1:40 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Moving forward and not landing is the same
as moving backwards and not landing. Otherwise you’re awarding guys for walking in certain directions and letting guys, like Leonard Garcia who should be 0-5 in the WEC wihtout debate, win undeserved fights. Meaning it’s a 10-10 score between the two actions.
BIG NOG for Life
One Step closer to Gleison Tibau @ 145
If the round is too close, it's 10-10, NOT flip a coin 10-9 or late takedown FTW.
by NNR (formerly NameNotRequired) on Nov 29, 2010 2:49 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
2 guys coming towards each other,
no matter how many times they connect can be a fight. 2 guys walking away from each other is not fighting.
Agree with Randy.
I feel bad for the fighters that clearly win & fucked over by horrible judging! We aren’t even seeing all the robberies either. When I went to ufc121 live there was like 3 fights they didn’t show on ppv were the fighters got robbed & every1 boo’d
"See, I think drugs have done some good things for us, I really do. And if you don't believe drugs have done good things for us, do me a Favor: go home tonight and take all your albums, all your tapes, and all your CDs and burn em. 'Cause you know what? The musicians who've made all that great music that's enhanced your lives throughout the years...
Rrrrrrrrrrrrreal fucking high on drugs."
by d*locc on Nov 29, 2010 1:41 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Agree and Disagree
I agree and disagree with Randy. I agree that the UFC and MMA needs to come up with a better scoring system 100% for sure. However I disagree with him with the Rampage comment leading to other situations. Rampage was pushing the pace the whole fight, had he not done that we would be watching an anderson silva fight where machida would circle the ring and wait for a counter the whole time. Guys like machida, anderson, shields and even randy on a few fights (vera vs randy) work the judges in a whole different way. The randy vs vera fight is a perfect example. he wont that fight for two reasons, 1 because he is randy couture and his name is massive and two because of octagon control??? really he pressed vera on the cage for 13 minutes. when they struck he was outstruck and vera took him down and controlled him for a good part of one round yet lost the fight 30-27 on two judges scorecards. another example is shields vs kampmann,, what the hell did shields do that whole fight,, he controlled him yes but didnt do any damage,, i would have scored the fight for kampman for fighting and trying new things. silva is in a league of his own when it comes to doing nothing in a fight unless the ufc gift wraps his opponents ie leites, maia, forrest griffen haha and now machida with his performance with rampage. i had that fight very close even giving it to machida, however i am extremely happy they didnt because they have to put a a stop to guiys not fighting!!!
and this better lead to gsp haters finally shutting the hell up because gsp may go 5 rounds but he is controlling and working the fight the whole time! unlike machida, shields, silva and many other fighters
Judges score on Aggressivness. Rampage > Machida
Everyone knows the judges score on aggressiveness. Rampage was more aggressive in my eyes in the first two rounds but it was very close. I feel Machida took the third bc he made his presence felt, had he fought like that the whole fight he would of won. Machida let it go to a decision and it was close so I feel his remarks about the bad judging only makes him look like a sore loser. So thats his style is what Soares said. Well his style cost him the fight. Adapt or become insignificant. This does not mean that I do not find some of the judging questionable. One of the biggest travesties that has caused my faith in the judging to be non existent was the Hamill vs Bisping fight. That Brit was outclassed in every aspect of fighting except aggressiveness of which Bisping barely pulled that one. Hamill owned Bisping but Bisping got the nod because those judges had no clue what they were doing.
by ScrapPackBackAgain on Nov 29, 2010 2:08 PM EST reply actions
Amen…u said it perfect,Machida has NO right to complain about judging being the gift he got wit the judging in his 1st fight wit shogun…Dana needs to put Machida on the under-card if he fights boring again CUT HIM
by phatmacjuggalo10 on Nov 29, 2010 2:26 PM EST up reply actions
Judges syhould be well versed in all aspects of fighting.
The Judges need to be trained in MMA. Just transitioning over from Boxing is not good enough but it is a start. Maybe the judges should be retired fighters ala Frank Shamrock, Royce or Renzo Gracie and Maurice Smith. I feel computers should be implemented to give judges a better feel of stats at the end of every round so they can have a reference point in which to gain some perspective. Fight Metric always helps me understand how the fight is turning out. The fight should not be scored by the computer but it should provide numbers and stats at the end of every round for the judges.
by ScrapPackBackAgain on Nov 29, 2010 2:16 PM EST reply actions
I think at this point having former fighters as judges would be a bad idea,
especially with guys like Royce Gracie and Maurice Smith who were extremely one-dimensional. I think that would lead to certain styles being over-valued if they were the primary ones employed by the judges themselves. I think former fighters are well suited to be refs (i.e. Herb Dean), but until the trule well-rounded fighters start retiring I don’t think we should have ex-fighters as judges.
"Before I do anything I ask myself, "Would an idiot do that?" And if the answer is yes, I do not do that thing." - Dwight Schrute
Herb Dean will never be remembered as a fighter.
I don’t think we will ever see an elite fighter make the rounds as a ref or judge.
Deuce has forced me to come out of the closet. If I could, I would keep this sig indefinitely, but Deuce says I am only worthy of carrying it for 2 weeks. I will be honored to carry this sig again after BJ destroys Jon Fitch. War BJ. BJ! BJ! BJ! BJ! BJ!
But I agree with the one-sidedness of certain guys. It is natural which is why wrestling currently dominates.
Most North American judges are familiar with amateur wrestling whihc scores 2 points for a TD and 1 point for an escape. It is ingrained in N.A. grappling to award the agrressor of TD’s with additional points, even if it shouldn’t. (I am the one who doesn’t want to opena can of worms now, Greg, lol)
Deuce has forced me to come out of the closet. If I could, I would keep this sig indefinitely, but Deuce says I am only worthy of carrying it for 2 weeks. I will be honored to carry this sig again after BJ destroys Jon Fitch. War BJ. BJ! BJ! BJ! BJ! BJ!
as a judge you must be aware of biases even unconscious ones
I am not implying to throw them in there now and let them judge. I think that through certification (i.e. classes and instructions) these guys can become great judges. They know the sport and they want to see it grow so they would have a lot to loose if they were acting on their biases. There are ways to control for biases of which I am not going to discuss bc it would take forever but these guys know the sport has grown and they have been a part of it. So with the assistance of computer stats every round i feel we could have some great judges and a huge pool of them.
by ScrapPackBackAgain on Nov 29, 2010 3:07 PM EST up reply actions
sucks to be you indeed.
You want a win? Finish the goddamn fight. If you don’t finish, I never want to hear anyone complain THEY were robbed. I was robbed, watching a fight with no ending. Like watching a porn scene with no cumshot, I want closure.
'How's taste my pee pee pee?'
This whole judging debate is getting to be up there with the Cain tattoo debate in how fucking overplayed it is.
Avoiding these threads from now on.
"I'm not superstitious, but I am a little stitious."-Michael Scott
^^ this
judging has been in dispute since the dawn of time (cavemen used to judge each other on women clubbing abilities). Any time decisions are based on human perception, there will be controversies.
MMA judging needs to be worked on, but it isn’t the end of the world. And this Rampage-Machida fight is a horrible example to use for bad judging,
"Why am I here? Why does my mind have wings? Why do blue midgets hit me with fish?!" - The Tick
Make them pass a competency test
Judges, especially those employed by the state, should be required to take and pass a test to get ceertified. Make sure these numb nuts are competent to judge what they see. Implement a yellow card system, a la PRIDE, and offer up finish bonuses. If they implement these 3 criteria, MMA would be a lot better IMO.
I thought there WERE finish bonuses
Besides SOTN/KOTN or the TUF finish bonuses.
As for certification, apparently Herb Dean’s now got a MMA Referee School in Pasadena, California, ABC-certified (that’s the Association of Boxing Commissions guys) and with a second class to start early next year.
As for the “yellow card” system… ehhh, I’m wary of these “discretionary” rules for the same reason that others are wary of “judging the whole fight.”
says the guy who got the nod over pedro in that fight. lol. it cuts both ways.
the same should be said of gray maynard among others.
Gatti. Dekkers. Pele. Aoki. Kang. Vanderlei. Basillio. Harry Greb.
by theworldsoldestsport on Nov 29, 2010 3:51 PM EST reply actions
stfu randy . go hold some more people against the cage for 12 mins
The Red Wings will come back stronger
RESTORE THE ROAR 2010 Detroit Lions
12 minutes?
"Why am I here? Why does my mind have wings? Why do blue midgets hit me with fish?!" - The Tick
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