CRAZY!!!!

Randy = foot in mouth

I wonder how much money Randy would have wanted to stay with the UFC? Can we really put a price on The Natural?

What a bad taste in my mouth… This is all bound to make Randy look really bad, what a shame…

This whole deal is BS..the thing that gets me on UFC brass..is their attitude. They are the white sharks..killa whales of MMA. Even if the $ stats are true..in a way i see Randy’s side still. Dana is living in a world above ours.

He started whining about his pay and what he wasn’t getting. Dana and the UFC called him on it, and now Randy looks like a tool.

Damn! He should be pissed. What a slap in the face.

Wasn’t this the amount that Randy stated he got? UFC are the ones who is saying he got payed more.

http://www.dailymotion.com/relevance/search/king of queens/video/x85rx_king-of-queens-mma-special_fun

MMA mania, write do a wednesday night fight video or something, its hilarious, he hits dan henderson adn he takes out his teeth! lol and frank trigg had the crappiest RNC ever LOl

Wasn’t this the amount that Randy stated he got? UFC are the ones who is saying he got payed more.

Exactly. Let’s see copies of the bonus and PPV percentage checks. Everybody’s already agreed that Randy got 250K to fight.

Wasn’t this the amount that Randy stated he got? UFC are the ones who is saying he got payed more.

He did get paid more, look at the page, notice the amount for the PPV hes gotten. I hope Randy reconsiders and takes the Nog fight, or comes clean about his reasons for leaving, because this is starting to make him seem like an ass.

PhilQNY
Oct 31st, 2007 at 9:26 am Quote this comment
This whole deal is BS..the thing that gets me on UFC brass..is their attitude. They are the white sharks..killa whales of MMA. Even if the $ stats are true..in a way i see Randy’s side still. Dana is living in a world above ours.

Thank you Phil, as a fellow Queens New Yorker, I hold the same view. Let’s be honest even if it is true, Randy and a list of maybe 5 other UFC fighters (Hughes, Liddell, Anderson Silva, and Franklin) are the few who are getting a percentage of PPV sales and making REAL MONEY. That leaves the other 97 % of fighters earning the mere $3,000 – $9,000 per fight if they win. It’s a complete shame and it’s very very sad.

As a fighter just to earn these “discretionary bonuses” you have to beat out essentially 7 other fights to earn A. fight of night B. sub of night or C. KO of night. Average fighter fights 3-4 times a year, muliply that by let’s call it $5,000.

THAT’S $20,000 Gross pay not net. Even with sponsorships they are not exactly living the high life, and couldn’t afford to live in Manhattan or any of the other boroughs of NEW YORK making that kind of dough. And Dana has the nerve to call these kinds PROFESSIONAL ATHLETES ? PAY THEM AS SUCH !

That is THE BONUS CHECK! it is dated 1/15/07 Dana said Randy got his bonus issued on that date and that he cashed it on the 30th of January. This makes Randy look like a liar, which he is, obviously.

LOOK AT THE BOTTOM LEFT HAND!!! where it says Comment: 2007 Signing Bonus! Wow I just saw that! Randy is a fcking liar!

Randy said he didn’t get a signing bonus. The cancelled check there clearly states the amount given is a “signing bonus”. Say what you want about Dana “living above” everyone but how many people just forget about receiving $500k?

what is randy saying??

Yeh but that’s 250,000…. I thought UFC said he got 500,000??

Ah sod it… I dont care about this story anymore. Either Randy man’s up and fights out his contract or I don’t wanna know.

I think he may ave just relised that he could have made more money out of the UFC for his last fights, and now he’s like “shit” I only have 2 fights left in me, i need to get as much from them as possible…

Good article at sherdog about a standard Zuffa contract. Check it out.

http://www.sherdog.com/news/articles.asp?n_id=9734

PhilQNY
Oct 31st, 2007 at 9:26 am Quote this comment
This whole deal is BS..the thing that gets me on UFC brass..is their attitude. They are the white sharks..killa whales of MMA. Even if the $ stats are true..in a way i see Randy’s side still. Dana is living in a world above ours.

Thank you Phil, as a fellow Queens New Yorker, I hold the same view. Let’s be honest even if it is true, Randy and a list of maybe 5 other UFC fighters (Hughes, Liddell, Anderson Silva, and Franklin) are the few who are getting a percentage of PPV sales and making REAL MONEY. That leaves the other 97 % of fighters earning the mere $3,000 – $9,000 per fight if they win. It’s a complete shame and it’s very very sad.

As a fighter just to earn these “discretionary bonuses” you have to beat out essentially 7 other fights to earn A. fight of night B. sub of night or C. KO of night. Average fighter fights 3-4 times a year, muliply that by let’s call it $5,000.

THAT’S $20,000 Gross pay not net. Even with sponsorships they are not exactly living the high life, and couldn’t afford to live in Manhattan or any of the other boroughs of NEW YORK making that kind of dough. And Dana has the nerve to call these kinds PROFESSIONAL ATHLETES ? PAY THEM AS SUCH !

i live in da bronx i agree too well said. JUST LISTENING TO DANA MAKES ME SICK, especially aabout FEDOR come one!!!!

Yeh but that’s 250,000…. I thought UFC said he got 500,000??

Ah sod it… I dont care about this story anymore. Either Randy man’s up and fights out his contract or I don’t wanna know.

I think he may ave just relised that he could have made more money out of the UFC for his last fights, and now he’s like “shit” I only have 2 fights left in me, i need to get as much from them as possible…

There are two $250,000 checks there. And I don’t fault him for wanting to maximize his earnings on what were likely to be his last two fights, but the way to do that is to renegotiate your existing contract, not lie about money you’ve obviously received.

I am still wondering about Randy’s position. He had to know that the UFC could produce the records. It doesn’t make sense. If you knew someone at the table had a royal flush and they knew you knew their hand, you couldn’t bluff them into laying down. In theory, Randy could have fought Nog and the Kongo/Tim winner by the end of May and still fought Fedor in September. Maybe Randy doesn’t feel he has 3 big fights left in him.

This whole deal is BS..the thing that gets me on UFC brass..is their attitude. They are the white sharks..killa whales of MMA. Even if the $ stats are true..in a way i see Randy’s side still. Dana is living in a world above ours.

I totally agree with this statement. Randy admitted earlier that he made close to 3 million this year. How he felt he was being treated was the issue.

Although I do have to say to Randy. You say love that you love the sport and want to see it grow. I suggest you fight harder for every other fighter out there. Guys like Calib Starnes who are listening to your comments and probably thinking, get over your self. This guy fights hard everytime he steps into the Octagon and has made televised fights in some major events. Then to hear him say that he didn’t even break even for this fight after all of his expenses makes me sick.

I understand that Randy has done a ton for this sport but truthfully how many people would go to a main event or buy the paper view if there were only one fight scheduled for the night. The UFC doesn’t realize how important those undercard fights are to fans.

I have one last thing to say and that is “FIGHTERS UNION”.

Nobody is making these guys become fighters, it’s what they want to do. If they want to make more money they need to be as exciting and marketable as possible. I don’t care if Kalib Starnes made $4000 on his last fight, his fights are boring! The big dogs SHOULD be the ones making the most cash, they’re the ones bringing in the viewers. I’m not paying $39.95 to watch Bill Johnson fight Bob Jones.

And who says all of the other fighters make $5000 per fight. The only fighters who make that little are the guys who’ve only fought a few times. You don’t just step into the octogon and demand $100K because you’re in the UFC, you have to work your way up to get there. And if they can’t fight their way up to that level then maybe they should be going to school and getting a degree so they CAN make a living.

PhilQNY
Oct 31st, 2007 at 9:26 am Quote this comment
This whole deal is BS..the thing that gets me on UFC brass..is their attitude. They are the white sharks..killa whales of MMA. Even if the $ stats are true..in a way i see Randy’s side still. Dana is living in a world above ours.

Thank you Phil, as a fellow Queens New Yorker, I hold the same view. Let’s be honest even if it is true, Randy and a list of maybe 5 other UFC fighters (Hughes, Liddell, Anderson Silva, and Franklin) are the few who are getting a percentage of PPV sales and making REAL MONEY. That leaves the other 97 % of fighters earning the mere $3,000 – $9,000 per fight if they win. It’s a complete shame and it’s very very sad.

As a fighter just to earn these “discretionary bonuses” you have to beat out essentially 7 other fights to earn A. fight of night B. sub of night or C. KO of night. Average fighter fights 3-4 times a year, muliply that by let’s call it $5,000.

THAT’S $20,000 Gross pay not net. Even with sponsorships they are not exactly living the high life, and couldn’t afford to live in Manhattan or any of the other boroughs of NEW YORK making that kind of dough. And Dana has the nerve to call these kinds PROFESSIONAL ATHLETES ? PAY THEM AS SUCH !

I agree but disagree more. Just because you are a proffessional athlete doesn’t justify living the high life. Olympic Athletes get paid nothing but they do it for other reasons. If all you do is fight, then that is something the fighter needs to deal with..nobody should just get handed a pay check for being a “Pro Athlete”.

The ufc isn’t as main stream as other sports and unlike baseball play enough games to pot revenues to justify paying fighters like ball players..these top notch fighters get paid b/c they bring the crowds and sell the pay per views.

Lesser known fighters are doing what any hungry and egar person would do..Pay their dues! Even people outside of the realm of professional sports this is reality. I started out in corporate real estate making 20k a year…but I worked hard and proved myself…Now I look back and that didnt matter b/c of where I am now and earning making 6 times that.

These guys are making 2 to 10k a fight because they are relatively unknown and unmarketable. It makes no business sence to pay someone who is unproven and who wont fill the seats. In time the payscale will adjust and average fighter purses will be greater. At the end of the day, its business, Dana and other promoters dont do this because they are nice guys and have nothing better to do – They invested in this business and are business people.

Step back and look at this..up until a few years ago MMA was nothing with respect to its presence in the Pro Sports market place…it was and in many cases still regarded as human cock fighting, has to over come political friction, survive bankruptcy and change/alter its rules to become regulated. Give it some time and these guys will be better known, people will accept it more as they will understand it more and there will more shows (regular tours, more ufc fight nights, TUF’s etc) that will lead to a bigger pot to spread around.

This sport is still in its infancy…. There is alot of room to grown especially internationally to places like Brazil, europe etc…

IMO Randy should of finished his contract and altered his deal. And if his contract ended while he still held the title he would get way more.

WoW! this makes Randy look really bad, unless we all know Dana White is a total asshole, maybe a fake slip…. just a thought trying to make things sound better for Randy because i mean he got kicked out of his squad on “The Unit” last night lol

LOOK AT THE BOTTOM LEFT HAND!!! where it says Comment: 2007 Signing Bonus! Wow I just saw that! Randy is a fcking liar!

yeah but, i dont see Randys signature anywhere they said he signed it, this could be a sheet that they made up. dont you think??

yeah but, i dont see Randys signature anywhere they said he signed it, this could be a sheet that they made up. dont you think??

I wish Randy Couture would just shut up and fight or just go away.

This whole deal is BS..the thing that gets me on UFC brass..is their attitude. They are the white sharks..killa whales of MMA. Even if the $ stats are true..in a way i see Randy’s side still. Dana is living in a world above ours.

Phil is surprises me that you’re defending Randy to the death on this one. He’s (normally) a great and standup guy but how can you see Randy’s point on this issue.

Randy lied to us all about getting a signing bonus (he said he didn’t get one when he clearly got two $250k signing bonus checks with his signatures on them) and he lied about not getting exposure (he’s about as exposed as the UFC has ever exposed someone). He gave them demands (that Dana said he would have been happy to meet and work out with him) but only gave them two weeks ot meet them WITHOUT telling the UFC that they had two weeks or he’d quit. He’s being unreasonable here.

It’s obvious that he doesn’t really want to work things out or he would be talking instead of running away from them at every turn. The UFC seems to be bending over backwards with giving him opportunity after opportunity to save face and return to his job. It’s Randy that keeps digging himself into the hole that he’s in now.

The UFC may be growing rapidly and in turn, losing it’s “personal” touch with fighters but… honestly… BOO HOO… they are all benefiting from the success and growth of the sport and the organization (ironically as I’m watching Randy Couture right now on the CBS TV show “the Unit” – poor guy seems to be really suffering in life – all because of the UFC’s growth and exposure)

And if Randy didn’t care about the money and only cared about the sport of MMA and the UFC organization and respect then why didn’t he allow his image in the $10 million ad campaign when Zuffa first bought the UFC to get it off the ground. He wanted money FROM Zuffa to promote RANDY with his own image so that RANDY could make more money and be more successful in the sport and in life. If everyone had done what he did, Zuffa would have never been able get the UFC where it is today and I wouldn’t be watching Randy guard a terrorist prisoner on “The Unit” TV show right now.

It looks like a pay stub, not the actual check.

If a CFO presents fraudulent documents of income of a fighter they can be fcked HARD by the IRS, so I doubt a company like the UFC would make this up!

Maybe Couture is suffering from early stages of Alzheimer’s or Parkingson’s deceases, he is clearly in need of a diagnose if he is going to have a press conferenece and deny things UFC has prove of!!

UFC had the nuts to come out and show proof! Randy is ill, maybe those 2 knockouts from Liddell damaged his brain.

No one ever said that they had to live the high life but enough to survive is ideal. Make sure these guys make $50 to $60 grand a year. I don’t think that is an outragous figure. Let’s take Calib starnes for example he may not be the best and his fights may not be overly exciting. When you have a guy who puts it on the line every time he steps into the octagon and is not assured a proper pay day is ridiculous.

For those of you who want to run the B level fighters down I would like to see what you had to see if it were you in that position. Then you could come onto this site and say that they don’t deserve to make enough money to feed their families because they are boring fighters.

The truth is as much as a lot of people want to believe these so called B level fighters sell more tickets than you might think. For those of you who believe these B level fighters aren’t important then answer one question for me. Would you buy a paper view for $40 if you were only going to see “Randy Couture vs. Chuck Lidell”. I know that most of the answers would be yes but how many times have we seen this type of match up as the main event? The truth is the ppv numbers would be a considerable amount less if they didn’t have undercard fights.

The amount of people who know the other big name fighters is getting bigger but if there were only one fight per ppv it would be much much less. The true die hard fans would be the mass majority and the sport would not have grown as it has in the past year. I mean who would have seen Clay Guida or even Tyson Griffin. Fighters like Roger Huerta and all of the TUF competitors. A lot of those guys have boring fights but they have been more important to this sport than the big name fighters.

I agree but disagree more. Just because you are a proffessional athlete doesn’t justify living the high life. Olympic Athletes get paid nothing but they do it for other reasons. If all you do is fight, then that is something the fighter needs to deal with..nobody should just get handed a pay check for being a “Pro Athlete”.

The ufc isn’t as main stream as other sports and unlike baseball play enough games to pot revenues to justify paying fighters like ball players..these top notch fighters get paid b/c they bring the crowds and sell the pay per views.

Lesser known fighters are doing what any hungry and egar person would do..Pay their dues! Even people outside of the realm of professional sports this is reality. I started out in corporate real estate making 20k a year…but I worked hard and proved myself…Now I look back and that didnt matter b/c of where I am now and earning making 6 times that.

These guys are making 2 to 10k a fight because they are relatively unknown and unmarketable. It makes no business sence to pay someone who is unproven and who wont fill the seats. In time the payscale will adjust and average fighter purses will be greater. At the end of the day, its business, Dana and other promoters dont do this because they are nice guys and have nothing better to do – They invested in this business and are business people.

Step back and look at this..up until a few years ago MMA was nothing with respect to its presence in the Pro Sports market place…it was and in many cases still regarded as human cock fighting, has to over come political friction, survive bankruptcy and change/alter its rules to become regulated. Give it some time and these guys will be better known, people will accept it more as they will understand it more and there will more shows (regular tours, more ufc fight nights, TUF’s etc) that will lead to a bigger pot to spread around.

This sport is still in its infancy…. There is alot of room to grown especially internationally to places like Brazil, europe etc…

IMO Randy should of finished his contract and altered his deal. And if his contract ended while he still held the title he would get way more.[/quote]

My problem with the UFC is " Your the big show " " Da Superbowl"..they have been preaching..marketing..their product is the best of the best of other MMA organizations.

 I use Nick Diaz as an example..he made it to the ufc..ko’d robbie lawler..had an impressive fights against Karo and deigo..even thou on the losing end of a decision. Is young..talented..and proven..cuz u know what to expect from him..he should of been made..he is on PPV..spiketv..but he like many top talented ufc fighters..wasn’t set. I’m in here..i made it..in reality they haven’t made squat. Like at the payouts of these ufc events..and compare it to other so called smaller shows..there is really no difference..just maybe with the number 1 and 2 fighters. This my beef with the UFC..Dana talks how the ufc has surpassed boxing and wwe ppv sales last year(look at what a ufc ppv/fightnight makes..add up all events in a fiscal year..get a sum total..then compare it to the total amount of fighter payouts)..ratings are competing with other pro sports. Dana says..fighters fight in the smaller shows to one day fight in the ufc..but still have to fight within ufc..to make it.

I look at Dana acting like a George Stienbrenner and the ufc as the Yanks..but paying his stable of fighters Brewers AAA $.

TO ALL THOSE WHO THINK THAT RANDY COUTURE IS THE VICTIM, OR YOU DON’T SEE HIS SIGNATURE ANYWHERE, OR CLICK ON THIS LINK!!!
RANDY COUTURE IS A LYING FCUK!!

http://www.mmanews.com/ufc/Photos:-Couture-Contracts-Checks-Given-At-UFC-Presser.html

Phil is surprises me that you’re defending Randy to the death on this one. He’s (normally) a great and standup guy but how can you see Randy’s point on this issue.

Randy lied to us all about getting a signing bonus (he said he didn’t get one when he clearly got two $250k signing bonus checks with his signatures on them) and he lied about not getting exposure (he’s about as exposed as the UFC has ever exposed someone). He gave them demands (that Dana said he would have been happy to meet and work out with him) but only gave them two weeks ot meet them WITHOUT telling the UFC that they had two weeks or he’d quit. He’s being unreasonable here.

It’s obvious that he doesn’t really want to work things out or he would be talking instead of running away from them at every turn. The UFC seems to be bending over backwards with giving him opportunity after opportunity to save face and return to his job. It’s Randy that keeps digging himself into the hole that he’s in now.

The UFC may be growing rapidly and in turn, losing it’s “personal” touch with fighters but… honestly… BOO HOO… they are all benefiting from the success and growth of the sport and the organization (ironically as I’m watching Randy Couture right now on the CBS TV show “the Unit” – poor guy seems to be really suffering in life – all because of the UFC’s growth and exposure)

And if Randy didn’t care about the money and only cared about the sport of MMA and the UFC organization and respect then why didn’t he allow his image in the $10 million ad campaign when Zuffa first bought the UFC to get it off the ground. He wanted money FROM Zuffa to promote RANDY with his own image so that RANDY could make more money and be more successful in the sport and in life. If everyone had done what he did, Zuffa would have never been able get the UFC where it is today and I wouldn’t be watching Randy guard a terrorist prisoner on “The Unit” TV show right now.

..I’m not 100% at all on Randy’s side on this..there is alot that we don’t know but assume..my arguement is the position the ufc has today..when I hear Dana talk about this and that..it starts to bug me. I’m a hundred 100% on the fighter’s side..cuz that’s what I love see see..fights.
Dana is flying on a magic carpet across the universe and is the gate keeper of MMA..the way he acts..even with the $ thing is true in the ufc’s favor with Randy..In a way..i still side with Randy..the worth of the company..the worth of the fighters..the distribution of wealth is off..and one sided.

Randy turned into such a cunt. He keeps saying “it’s not about the money”. Then he continues on about how he didnt get what others did. Yeah right Randy……you’re clear like glass, we can see right through. IT IS ALLLLLLLL ABOUT THE MONEY!

So STOP interjecting the “it’s not about the money” quim into your tirades.

Randy should have been paid more money. Maybe if the UFC had a fair and balanced payroll they wouldn’t be in this situation. Randy will be free from his ufc contract in 9 months.

I agree but disagree more. Just because you are a proffessional athlete doesn’t justify living the high life. Olympic Athletes get paid nothing but they do it for other reasons.
(“No one said that everyone should be living the highlife. You can’t compare these guys to olympic athletes that makes no sense. They do there particular sport one time in 2 to 4 years.”)

Lesser known fighters are doing what any hungry and egar person would do..Pay their dues! Even people outside of the realm of professional sports this is reality. I started out in corporate real estate making 20k a year…but I worked hard and proved myself…Now I look back and that didnt matter b/c of where I am now and earning making 6 times that.
(“I am glad to hear that you did well enough in real estate to support you and who ever else it is that you support. Have you ever gotten a gash to the forehead that took 20 or more stitches from showing a house to a potential client. That sort of thing can take a lot of money out of a fighters pocket but I am sure that has crossed your mind. No offense but 20k a year is not nearly enough for these guys to train and live off of.”)

In time the payscale will adjust and average fighter purses will be greater. At the end of the day, its business, Dana and other promoters dont do this because they are nice guys and have nothing better to do – They invested in this business and are business people.
(“You are forgetting what normal business do for their employees. Annual salary and benefits. Yea business men is right but the most greedy type.”)

Step back and look at this..up until a few years ago MMA was nothing with respect to its presence in the Pro Sports market place…it was and in many cases still regarded as human cock fighting, has to over come political friction, survive bankruptcy and change/alter its rules to become regulated. Give it some time and these guys will be better known, people will accept it more as they will understand it more and there will more shows (regular tours, more ufc fight nights, TUF’s etc) that will lead to a bigger pot to spread around.
(“In this area you are totally right but it doesn’t mean that these guys don’t deserve to do this for their living. If Zuffa didn’t want to have to worry about fighters talking about money then they never should have bought the organization. It is like any other business.”)

IMO Randy should of finished his contract and altered his deal. And if his contract ended while he still held the title he would get way more.
(“Agreed”)

Everyone gets down on Dana White and zuffa, but just think if they did not buy the UFC and make it what it is none of these guys would be making the money they are and allot of guys would not have the chance they have, do you think 5 or 7 years ago Randy would be getting paid what he is plus a signing bonus of anything? remember its business UFC is there to make money its not a charity to give guys a place to fight and get rich, no the UFC is there to make money but if a fighter can get rich fighting too thats awesome

I think we need another press conference to clear things up.

pw
Oct 31st, 2007 at 10:39 am Quote this comment
LOOK AT THE BOTTOM LEFT HAND!!! where it says Comment: 2007 Signing Bonus! Wow I just saw that! Randy is a fcking liar!

yeah but, i dont see Randys signature anywhere they said he signed it, this could be a sheet that they made up. dont you think??

It looks like a pay stub, not the actual check.

Exactly it isn’t a check byt rather a pay stub. Hellow we all get them on thusday or friday in America, depending on your cycle at work. Nice job of producing a stub. Bottom line who cares about the signing bonus. What about the UFC actually makign Randy feel less than what he is should be the issue.

I have one last thing to say and that is “FIGHTERS UNION”.

I think Randy’s new love is acting.

All this is doing is pushing Randy even further away from ever fighting for the UFC. I doubt randy will respond to the zuffa press conference im sure he wants to but I think hes ganna be the bigger man and just drop it enough is enough like RC said its not about money its about respect.

How dumb were those reporters asking questions did they even watch Randys press conference. Zuffa made it sound like randy called them and said can I please fight tim for the title, while Randy said after being OFFERED 3 MILLION to fight Fedor in Bodog he was loyal and went to lerenzo and dana to tell them what he was offered and they were like fight for us instead WE NEED SOMEONE TO FIGHT TIM for the heavywieght title.

aND WHY WAS RC NOT OFFERED A POST FIGHT BONUS AFTER BEATING GG WHICH WAS a great fight, he received a bonus after liddell/couture III and the tim fight. where the hell was that question.

this whole situation is like the twilight zone.

Off the subject:]

YOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!I made on the Top Manic list…yeah boy!!

that just made my day.

Thanks for the link Anbre81

If Randy decides to finish his last two fights with ufc..it’s a tuff PR move..cuz all that was said and put out into the public..Dana just gets under my skin..he should of gotten bitch slapped when he aired that “Bad Blood” with Tito..I wasted two hours of my life that I can’t get back..cuz I was gassed that there going to be fight. I would love to see a Randy vs Fedor..I would like to see a Randy vs Nog. but this whole deal smells like ass cheeks.

What do undercard unknowns get paid in boxing?

Did anyone else notice the inconsistency in Couture’s signatures?
The back of a couple of those checks are clearly signed by someone else.
Makes you wonder if he maybe didn’t “see” everything he was getting.

No one ever said that they had to live the high life but enough to survive is ideal. Make sure these guys make $50 to $60 grand a year. I don’t think that is an outragous figure. Let’s take Calib starnes for example he may not be the best and his fights may not be overly exciting. When you have a guy who puts it on the line every time he steps into the octagon and is not assured a proper pay day is ridiculous.

For those of you who want to run the B level fighters down I would like to see what you had to see if it were you in that position. Then you could come onto this site and say that they don’t deserve to make enough money to feed their families because they are boring fighters.

The truth is as much as a lot of people want to believe these so called B level fighters sell more tickets than you might think. For those of you who believe these B level fighters aren’t important then answer one question for me. Would you buy a paper view for $40 if you were only going to see “Randy Couture vs. Chuck Lidell”. I know that most of the answers would be yes but how many times have we seen this type of match up as the main event? The truth is the ppv numbers would be a considerable amount less if they didn’t have undercard fights.

The amount of people who know the other big name fighters is getting bigger but if there were only one fight per ppv it would be much much less. The true die hard fans would be the mass majority and the sport would not have grown as it has in the past year. I mean who would have seen Clay Guida or even Tyson Griffin. Fighters like Roger Huerta and all of the TUF competitors. A lot of those guys have boring fights but they have been more important to this sport than the big name fighters.

The thing is, though, most of those b-class fighters were absolute nobodies when they signed the contract, and the UFC is GIVING them the opportunity to become somebody, and get sponsorships and endorsements, and renegotiate for more when the deal is up. Lower level fighters are paid well, just not in money.

When they enter the UFC, most fighters are indistinguishable from dozens of other fighters who aren’t in the UFC. The UFC is giving them a HUGE opportunity to make a name for themselves, that those other fighters aren’t getting. Thinking that fighters are only getting reimbursed with money is foolish; they’re getting reimbursed with fame, which they can turn into money.

People People…. dont yall realize this is what dana wanted…He knit picked one of the statements that Randy said in regards to him quitting so that he(dana) could save face and be like you see I told you guys Randy is a liar and these are the facts. We all have to remember that he felt disrespected by the amount that Fedor was being offered… I mean how would yall feel if someone that you have basically bled and fought for told you that you are really appreciated and then turned around and offerred someone like fedor a crap load more money even though fedor hasnt done shit for the UFC… So whos the liar? is it dana for misleading randy into thinking that he was being compensated fairly and then turning around and tripling the amount for some a-hole that wont fight cause of a f-in sambo tournament. Or.. Is Randy the liar for not honoring a contract that he apparently was satisfied with but now regrets after finding out that he is worth no where near as much as someone who has done nothing for the UFC..

Phil is surprises me that you’re defending Randy to the death on this one. He’s (normally) a great and standup guy but how can you see Randy’s point on this issue.

Randy lied to us all about getting a signing bonus (he said he didn’t get one when he clearly got two $250k signing bonus checks with his signatures on them) and he lied about not getting exposure (he’s about as exposed as the UFC has ever exposed someone). He gave them demands (that Dana said he would have been happy to meet and work out with him) but only gave them two weeks ot meet them WITHOUT telling the UFC that they had two weeks or he’d quit. He’s being unreasonable here.

It’s obvious that he doesn’t really want to work things out or he would be talking instead of running away from them at every turn. The UFC seems to be bending over backwards with giving him opportunity after opportunity to save face and return to his job. It’s Randy that keeps digging himself into the hole that he’s in now.

The UFC may be growing rapidly and in turn, losing it’s “personal” touch with fighters but… honestly… BOO HOO… they are all benefiting from the success and growth of the sport and the organization (ironically as I’m watching Randy Couture right now on the CBS TV show “the Unit” – poor guy seems to be really suffering in life – all because of the UFC’s growth and exposure)

And if Randy didn’t care about the money and only cared about the sport of MMA and the UFC organization and respect then why didn’t he allow his image in the $10 million ad campaign when Zuffa first bought the UFC to get it off the ground. He wanted money FROM Zuffa to promote RANDY with his own image so that RANDY could make more money and be more successful in the sport and in life. If everyone had done what he did, Zuffa would have never been able get the UFC where it is today and I wouldn’t be watching Randy guard a terrorist prisoner on “The Unit” TV show right now.

VERY WELL SAID EdenMachine, I agree 110%. At first when all this news broke,like most, I took Randy’s side. I am very happy that I had the opportunity to watch the UFC press conference live yesterday. WOW did they prove Randy wrong or what? I am now on the UFC’s side for sure.

The only valid point Randy has for ‘resigning’ from his contract is that he only wants one more fight = Fedor.

I have so much that I can say about this matter, I just dont have the time.

I think Randy is right on this issue. Hear me out. If “Dana” and “company” are telling the truth and Randy is a liar, that would mean Randy isn’t worthy of having a charity for THE TROOPS. THE TROOPS are THE HEROES and fight for FREEDOM. Also anyone could do "Dana"’s job, even a gay. Hell, especially a gay. Well maybe if the gay was white. Also Randy fights and “Dana” doesn’t so I’m pretty sure you can’t trust “Dana” because UFCs are made by fighters who should be getting the money. UFCs aren’t made by production crews, athletic commissions, piss laboratories, announcers, stadium staff, lawyers, accountants, marketers, or TV deals. UFC doesn’t need any of those things and to prove it let me say this: No fighting organization has ever failed to turn a profit and had to leave its fighters without a job. All shows are profitable even the smaller shows. If the fighters aren’t getting enough money to live on from the UFC then I don’t see why they don’t start up their own promotions to make that money for themselves. All they would need is knowledge about screwing in light bulbs and running camcorders.

Then you can basically say “NO MORE UFC”. A union would be the worst thing for everyone including fans if a UFC fighters union would be formed. Apparently you haven’t had a lot of exposure what an athlete’s union is really like.

I dont know much but I do know that if the fighters demand and they will recieve… I believe that a union would force the ufc to pay more b/c it would be better to lose money in paying guys what they fucken deserve then to lose money in b/c there are no fights…
  If I was making 20g a year forming a union would not be the worst thing for me at all considering that 20g I could make working min wage..

aND WHY WAS RC NOT OFFERED A POST FIGHT BONUS AFTER BEATING GG WHICH WAS a great fight, he received a bonus after liddell/couture III and the tim fight. where the hell was that question.

Fight bonuses are discretionary. Dana can award however much bonus money he wants to whomever he wants. That’s why they call it a ‘bonus’ and not ‘money to be awarded, as stipulated by contract.’

I’ve always had respect for the facts and as much as I would like to take randy’s side I can’t he’s clearly either a liar,nuts or has been screwed over by his manager. They pay him very well considering what his record was when he signed… 14/8 not so great and since 2002 he hasn’t won more than 2 fights in a row hardly qualifies him as a top fighter. 2.9 million is a lot of money for 2 fights, what the hell does this guy expect? he’s the second highest paid fighter in the ufc and wants to be number one, why I seriously wouldn’t put him on a top 10 pound for pound fighters list and doubt he’s better than fedor. Man does he sound petty, hollywoods turning him into an ego maniac with a god complex. Dana should offer randy to fight nog then if he refuses consider him retired and never let him work for the ufc again, they’ll be just fine without him.

YOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!I made on the Top Manic list…yeah boy!!

that just made my day.

Congrats Phil!!!!!!!!

if Randy was not happy with the contract he was offered he should not have signed it, if he thought Fedor was getting more than he was and that he (Randy) was worth more he should Renegotiate when his contract is up for renewal, this is a business and a contract is a contract.

Congrats Phil!!!!!!!!

..thanks VM..I feel official now.

The thing is, though, most of those b-class fighters were absolute nobodies when they signed the contract, and the UFC is GIVING them the opportunity to become somebody, and get sponsorships and endorsements, and renegotiate for more when the deal is up. Lower level fighters are paid well, just not in money.

When they enter the UFC, most fighters are indistinguishable from dozens of other fighters who aren’t in the UFC. The UFC is giving them a HUGE opportunity to make a name for themselves, that those other fighters aren’t getting. Thinking that fighters are only getting reimbursed with money is foolish; they’re getting reimbursed with fame, which they can turn into money.

Man, I’d love to be your boss. I won’t pay you what you deserve, but at least I’m giving you an “opportunity”.

this is getting out of control. if the man wants to walk away at the top of the food chain and payscale in the best organization in the world to do C-caliber movies, let him. doesn’t seem like the best idea in the world to me. he is letting a lot of people down.

Dana said in the press confrence he had “almost 100 employees”.. i would of thought more than that…(like maybee 1000)

..Dana is flying on a magic carpet across the universe and is the gate keeper of MMA..the way he acts..even with the $ thing is true in the ufc’s favor with Randy..In a way..i still side with Randy..the worth of the company..the worth of the fighters..the distribution of wealth is off..and one sided.

I have been a staunch supporter of Randy Couture for the exact same reasons. I base my decision’s on new information and in light of this, I have to side with the UFC versus Couture. The manner in which Couture brought this up and handled it has really blew his presentation and credibility. He left off a few hundred thousand here and there in presenting facts to the press, “You can’t do that, even if it’s unintentional.”

I still side with Couture and his feelings towards fighter pay and he would have been the perfect choice to debate this or form a fighter’s union. However, the only legitimate claims to date are: Why didn’t he get a bonus for the Gonzaga fight? Did Fedor really get offered millions by the UFC?

Randy needs to speak with Dana on a face to face personal level and needs to be very wise and clear the next time he speaks in public, otherwise he’s going to go from hero to zero for sure.

The thing is, though, most of those b-class fighters were absolute nobodies when they signed the contract, and the UFC is GIVING them the opportunity to become somebody, and get sponsorships and endorsements, and renegotiate for more when the deal is up. Lower level fighters are paid well, just not in money.

When they enter the UFC, most fighters are indistinguishable from dozens of other fighters who aren’t in the UFC. The UFC is giving them a HUGE opportunity to make a name for themselves, that those other fighters aren’t getting. Thinking that fighters are only getting reimbursed with money is foolish; they’re getting reimbursed with fame, which they can turn into money.

I understand your point but as everyone is saying they are a business. When the company that you work for hired you they took a risk on you, correct? They only knew of you from your resume and word of mouth but they still hired you and paid you a wage. Would you be upset if this company said that you were involved in making us millions of dollars but we are only going to pay you minum wage. I am sure that would upset you as well. Now think of it this way. You are only going to get paid 4 times a year by this company. You have to spread that money out over 12 months. Then when you do get paid your company says well you didn’t make your quota so we are only paying you half of your salary. I don’t care what anyone says if that were happening at let’s say Chrysler, Wal-Mart, Google, etc. there would be a lot of angry people. Now I don’t know if you work full-time or if you are still in shchool or what.

The point is that these fighters deserve better. I am not saying make every guy who fights a millionaire because that makes no sense. A lot of guys who fight won’t amount to squat but there is always a diamond in the ruff. That is business.

FIGHTERS UNION

if Randy was not happy with the contract he was offered he should not have signed it, if he thought Fedor was getting more than he was and that he (Randy) was worth more he should Renegotiate when his contract is up for renewal, this is a business and a contract is a contract.

Good post. I totally agree.

Congrats Phil!!!!!!!!

Yeah, Uhh…. How could one say that Clay Guida or Tyson Griffin have boring fights?… those were the wrong 2 to use in your example. In Tyson Griffin’s last fight against Tavares he put on a clinic, it was amazing… the best technical matchup of the night IMO. Tyson Griffin vs. Clay Guida was also an amazing fight… so yeah, that comment was suspect.

Then you can basically say “NO MORE UFC”. A union would be the worst thing for everyone including fans if a UFC fighters union would be formed. Apparently you haven’t had a lot of exposure what an athlete’s union is really like.

You right I haven’t had a lot of personal experience with a athletic players union but I understand the concept of a Union. This would definitely be a good thing for the sport. No more wondering for these guys how much money they will make on their next fight. It seems that Major League Baseball, Professional Football, and Professional Basketball have all done pretty well for themselves.

You have to understand. A lot of these fighters do not have degrees and there understanding on structuring a contract is non existent. We have seen it numerous times with young athletes. At least with a union it will allow the fighters to make sure that they are getting paid a certain amount every year.

If I am way off base with how a players Union is ran then please by all means fill me in.

Are some of you blind? look at this link before you post stupidities

http://www.mmanews.com/ufc/Photos:-Couture-Contracts-Checks-Given-At-UFC-Presser.html

News on Dan Henderson:

http://www.mmanews.com/ufc/Dan-Henderson-To-Fight-At-185-lbs.-On-UFC-79-Card.html

..I’m not 100% at all on Randy’s side on this..there is alot that we don’t know but assume..my arguement is the position the ufc has today..when I hear Dana talk about this and that..it starts to bug me. I’m a hundred 100% on the fighter’s side..cuz that’s what I love see see..fights.
Dana is flying on a magic carpet across the universe and is the gate keeper of MMA..the way he acts..even with the $ thing is true in the ufc’s favor with Randy..In a way..i still side with Randy..the worth of the company..the worth of the fighters..the distribution of wealth is off..and one sided.

But seriuosly, would anyone care if Kaleb Starnes decided to go manage a Blockbuster Video instead of fighting? Wouldn’t there be 40 other fighters to jump right into his place? That’s the thing. Dana doesn’t have to pay the newer guys much money and a lot of them work a real job and just fight on the side until they get good and get exposure for the big money.

It’s the way of the world folks. If the UFC gave every fighter $100k for every fight there would be no UFC – plain and simple.

You can hate Dana because he has a mouth like a sailor but you can’t hate him for providing the best entertainment in the world… UFC PPV fights!! He does it right! That’s why we’re all on this site right now.

I agree but disagree more. Just because you are a proffessional athlete doesn’t justify living the high life. Olympic Athletes get paid nothing but they do it for other reasons.
(“No one said that everyone should be living the highlife. You can’t compare these guys to olympic athletes that makes no sense. They do there particular sport one time in 2 to 4 years.”) Not true, some compete several times a year… and the point was they do it because, they first and foremost love to do it…… Hence Athlete…Came out of interest.

Lesser known fighters are doing what any hungry and egar person would do..Pay their dues! Even people outside of the realm of professional sports this is reality. I started out in corporate real estate making 20k a year…but I worked hard and proved myself…Now I look back and that didnt matter b/c of where I am now and earning making 6 times that.
(“I am glad to hear that you did well enough in real estate to support you and who ever else it is that you support. Have you ever gotten a gash to the forehead that took 20 or more stitches from showing a house to a potential client. That sort of thing can take a lot of money out of a fighters pocket but I am sure that has crossed your mind. No offense but 20k a year is not nearly enough for these guys to train and live off of.”) First off – Its corporate Real Estate ..No houses in this industry, Secondly, Self Employeed really, I had no benefits to start, Third, Not being able to eat well or have nice things like Cable and nice shoes etc…Sucked. As a matter of fact I had a nasal reconstruction, 15 stitches to the forehead and almost lost my right eye from a hockey incident….Trying to play pro in europe..Was paid nothing…and still ate a puck for it. Forth, face the reality of it…. These guys know what they are going to get paid and accept it..if your not willing to get the snot potentially beat of you for 5k – DONT SIGN up for the fight. Fifth, if all you can do is fight for a living, you have issues…try taking up a trade or working labour..Support yourself..Just like any starving student or aspiring actor. Those hours working as a waiter or janitor will not kill you. Sixth, I train Muy Thai and Vale Tudo style combat 4 times a week…So I am not talking out of my rear. I would never train for something like this as a career without backing myself up – i.e. education, second job etc… Its sad but its just the way it is.

Check out Mac Danzig, suppliments his income selling his photography…..there is always a way to make coin!

In time the payscale will adjust and average fighter purses will be greater. At the end of the day, its business, Dana and other promoters dont do this because they are nice guys and have nothing better to do – They invested in this business and are business people.
(“You are forgetting what normal business do for their employees. Annual salary and benefits. Yea business men is right but the most greedy type.”). What insurance company would give you benefits for something like this?? Come on. This is what you chose to do, again accept the reality of it. Can’t blame Zuffa for that.

Step back and look at this..up until a few years ago MMA was nothing with respect to its presence in the Pro Sports market place…it was and in many cases still regarded as human cock fighting, has to over come political friction, survive bankruptcy and change/alter its rules to become regulated. Give it some time and these guys will be better known, people will accept it more as they will understand it more and there will more shows (regular tours, more ufc fight nights, TUF’s etc) that will lead to a bigger pot to spread around.
(“In this area you are totally right but it doesn’t mean that these guys don’t deserve to do this for their living. If Zuffa didn’t want to have to worry about fighters talking about money then they never should have bought the organization. It is like any other business.”)

Thanks!

IMO Randy should of finished his contract and altered his deal. And if his contract ended while he still held the title he would get way more.
(“Agreed”)[/quote]

In the end, the reality is tough for a fighter, If you are one, I wish you the best of luck.

Just patting myself on the back. I called this and tried to post the thread yesterday but kept getting blocked

You right I haven’t had a lot of personal experience with a athletic players union but I understand the concept of a Union. This would definitely be a good thing for the sport. No more wondering for these guys how much money they will make on their next fight. It seems that Major League Baseball, Professional Football, and Professional Basketball have all done pretty well for themselves.

You have to understand. A lot of these fighters do not have degrees and there understanding on structuring a contract is non existent. We have seen it numerous times with young athletes. At least with a union it will allow the fighters to make sure that they are getting paid a certain amount every year.

If I am way off base with how a players Union is ran then please by all means fill me in.

MLB, NFL, and NBA are all much different situations than the UFC, because those are actually monopolistic organizations. And you still haven’t responded to the fact that there are a lot of fighters who would kill to get into the UFC. UFC pay is based on supply and demand, not on fighters not understanding how contracts work.

LOOK at the difference at the signatures!!!
if i was a bank teller i wouldn’t have cashed these checks or deposited them!

wish my check look like that.hell for that matter i wish my yearly wages look like that.

This is so stupid but atleast we get an idea of what they pay for PPV’s.

Maybe Randy’s wife takes the money before he gets it…….;)

yeah but, i dont see Randys signature anywhere they said he signed it, this could be a sheet that they made up. dont you think??

NO! The UFC is shrewd, not stupid.

PhilQNY
Oct 31st, 2007 at 9:26 am Quote this comment
This whole deal is BS..the thing that gets me on UFC brass..is their attitude. They are the white sharks..killa whales of MMA. Even if the $ stats are true..in a way i see Randy’s side still. Dana is living in a world above ours.

Thank you Phil, as a fellow Queens New Yorker, I hold the same view. Let’s be honest even if it is true, Randy and a list of maybe 5 other UFC fighters (Hughes, Liddell, Anderson Silva, and Franklin) are the few who are getting a percentage of PPV sales and making REAL MONEY. That leaves the other 97 % of fighters earning the mere $3,000 – $9,000 per fight if they win. It’s a complete shame and it’s very very sad.

As a fighter just to earn these “discretionary bonuses” you have to beat out essentially 7 other fights to earn A. fight of night B. sub of night or C. KO of night. Average fighter fights 3-4 times a year, muliply that by let’s call it $5,000.

THAT’S $20,000 Gross pay not net. Even with sponsorships they are not exactly living the high life, and couldn’t afford to live in Manhattan or any of the other boroughs of NEW YORK making that kind of dough. And Dana has the nerve to call these kinds PROFESSIONAL ATHLETES ? PAY THEM AS SUCH !

Just like Matt Serra huh? All you people speculate, but no other fighter is complaining other that Randy. And now he looks like a whiny typical hollywood athlete.

I’m surprised the cover letter signed by Dana doesn’t have any curse words in it. I was expecting something along the lines of:

“Dear Randy,
DO YOU WANT TO BE A FUCKIN’ FIGHTER?! WELL HERE’S TWO HUNDRED FIFTY GRAND!

Yours eternally,
Dana White

PS—Fuck."

My problem with the UFC is " Your the big show " " Da Superbowl"..they have been preaching..marketing..their product is the best of the best of other MMA organizations.

I use Nick Diaz as an example..he made it to the ufc..ko’d robbie lawler..had an impressive fights against Karo and deigo..even thou on the losing end of a decision. Is young..talented..and proven..cuz u know what to expect from him..he should of been made..he is on PPV..spiketv..but he like many top talented ufc fighters..wasn’t set. I’m in here..i made it..in reality they haven’t made squat. Like at the payouts of these ufc events..and compare it to other so called smaller shows..there is really no difference..just maybe with the number 1 and 2 fighters. This my beef with the UFC..Dana talks how the ufc has surpassed boxing and wwe ppv sales last year(look at what a ufc ppv/fightnight makes..add up all events in a fiscal year..get a sum total..then compare it to the total amount of fighter payouts)..ratings are competing with other pro sports. Dana says..fighters fight in the smaller shows to one day fight in the ufc..but still have to fight within ufc..to make it.

I look at Dana acting like a George Stienbrenner and the ufc as the Yanks..but paying his stable of fighters Brewers AAA $.

The reason guys like Starnes get paid like crap is b/c there are hundreds of guys out there who would be happy to fight in the UFC for 7 grand. In fact there are a ton of guys who would fight for less. I’m not trying to dog Starnes, but you used him as an example so, 1. No one said he has to fight for 7k a fight to show 2. No one says he has to fight at all 3. Find a better job if your current job doesn’t pay the bills.

BTW, Jason Black(another B fighter) only got paid like 8k to show for his fight at UFC 77, but he also got an extra 40k for having the most exciting fight of the night. That’s my way of saying that the UFC takes care of guys who put on good fights. Almost 50k for an undercard non PPV fight is a pretty good payday. Not everyone gets that so make sure you stand out in your fight if you want a chance to earn some extra cash.

Not true, some compete several times a year… and the point was they do it because, they first and foremost love to do it…… Hence Athlete…Came out of interest.
(“These would not be considered Olympic athletes then. I understand what you are saying though. The problem is this situation is totally different so making this comparison makes no sense. The UFC is the fastest growing sport out there and the amount of money that they are making warrants better pay for the athletes. I am not saying that every professional sport should pay their athletes extremely well. In the UFC’s case they have an opportunity to make there brand main stream like the NFL or the NBA but may have trouble if they get a bad rap for treating their fighters poorly.”)

First off – Its corporate Real Estate ..No houses in this industry, Secondly, Self Employeed really, I had no benefits to start, Third, Not being able to eat well or have nice things like Cable and nice shoes etc…Sucked. As a matter of fact I had a nasal reconstruction, 15 stitches to the forehead and almost lost my right eye from a hockey incident….Trying to play pro in europe..Was paid nothing…and still ate a puck for it. Forth, face the reality of it…. These guys know what they are going to get paid and accept it..if your not willing to get the snot potentially beat of you for 5k – DONT SIGN up for the fight. Fifth, if all you can do is fight for a living, you have issues…try taking up a trade or working labour..Support yourself..Just like any starving student or aspiring actor. Those hours working as a waiter or janitor will not kill you. Sixth, I train Muy Thai and Vale Tudo style combat 4 times a week…So I am not talking out of my rear. I would never train for something like this as a career without backing myself up – i.e. education, second job etc… Its sad but its just the way it is.
(“I could go on about this forever but in your case you tried to get there. That is very admirable and I am sure that you gave it 100% to make it big. This is the way to look at the UFC in my mind. Which maybe it isn’t there yet and maybe I am premature about it. They are like the NBA, NFL, MLB, and NHL. The main stream organizations in there respective sport. You were playing semi pro which is totally different. I am not saying pay WEC fighters a terrific salary. I mean semi pro baseball players make like $800 a month unless you are a pro prospect. Even then it is mostly signing bonus. As for your nose issue I am sure you weren’t thinking at the time. It is all for the sport I am glad I am playing at least. No you were probably thinking how am I going to pay for this and that is semi pro. These guys are the elite even if they are B fighters. Don’t try to tell me there are a lot of fighters out there better than some of the B level fighters in the UFC. I know a lot of baseball and basketball players out there that are better than some of the pros. That is how life goes. Not everyone gets a shot.”)

Check out Mac Danzig, suppliments his income selling his photography…..there is always a way to make coin!(Mac Danzig isn’t in the big show yet. If he wins TUFF 6 he will be but until then he is playing AAA.")

In the end, the reality is tough for a fighter, If you are one, I wish you the best of luck.
(“I am not a fighter. Just looking at this on their side. Put in the hours and see all the money being made by everyone else. It has to be disheartening.”)

looks like randy needed a excuse to get out of fighting to start acting, and got caught, what he should do is fight the rest of his contract and then retire,

MLB, NFL, and NBA are all much different situations than the UFC, because those are actually monopolistic organizations. And you still haven’t responded to the fact that there are a lot of fighters who would kill to get into the UFC. UFC pay is based on supply and demand, not on fighters not understanding how contracts work.

I don’t see how the UFC is that much different. The UFC is the big show. A huge majority of the best talent in the world is fighting for this organization. I would have to say that this is as close to monopolistic as it gets. As for the fighters that would kill to get into the UFC. What do you want me to say. I guess there aren’t millions of athletes around the world that would like to be a basketball player, baseball player, football player, hockey player, cyclist, skateboarder, etc. I guess MMA is the only sport out there that has athletes dieing to make it big. Not every person that becomes a fighter is going to get the big pay day. That is professional sports plain and simple.

As for the pay being a supply and demand issue. Uh…..OK what business isn’t. I am not saying pay these B level fighters hundreds of thousands of dollars. Find a good pay scale and give them that. If they deserve more restructure their contracts to reflect that like they do now. I am not talking about taking money away or eliminating bonuses and paperview shares just give them a sure thing. I have used him before because of what happened in his last fight. Take Calib Starnes for example he may not be able to fight for a while because of the huge cut he suffered. This is going to hurt his income for the year, I am sure he would feel better if he knew he was going to make $35000 this year.

I think Randy is making so much money that he has lost track of it.

“Fifth, if all you can do is fight for a living, you have issues…try taking up a trade or working labour..Support yourself..Just like any starving student or aspiring actor. Those hours working as a waiter or janitor will not kill you. Sixth, I train Muy Thai and Vale Tudo style combat 4 times a week…So I am not talking out of my rear. I would never train for something like this as a career without backing myself up – i.e. education, second job etc”

Deyo, I had to say something about this. I am sure a huge portion of these fighters could, have, or are supplementing their incomes with other jobs. Anyone can go out and find a job to support themselves. The issue here is that we are not talking about the average every day Joe trying to make it big in MMA. We are talking about highly skilled fighters that have trained years and are putting their bodies on the line everytime they step into the octagon or ring. If you went to school to become a surgeon and got hired. When you get through your residency years the hospital says, you know what we are only going to pay you fifty thousands dollars a year. Would you be upset? I know I would. I am sure a lot of these guys have done exactly what you are saying. Now they have an opportunity to do what they have given up so much for to pay the bills. I say they should be able to.

By the way what is your name I will look for you in the next PPV.

If Randy decides to finish his last two fights with ufc..it’s a tuff PR move..cuz all that was said and put out into the public..Dana just gets under my skin..he should of gotten bitch slapped when he aired that “Bad Blood” with Tito..I wasted two hours of my life that I can’t get back..cuz I was gassed that there going to be fight. I would love to see a Randy vs Fedor..I would like to see a Randy vs Nog. but this whole deal smells like ass cheeks.

I hear you, I’m a big Couture fan, but Randy needs to fix this with the UFC and get his facts correct to a "T’ when presenting them to the public and keep his wife out of his MMA affairs.

Any further statements should be to settle this dispute, without perpetuating any further ill will towards the UFC.
If a well spoken Randy mans up, and is truly apologetic, I think this will eventually somewhat be behind him. A BIG UFC fight always has a way of overshadowing character flaws.

Unless of course, Couture has an ACE in the hole and can put a miracle spin on this.

i hate people who say dana white was the loser this past little while, its so randy couture, remember the ufc will go on without randy couture, without the ufc randy couture is a nobody (not taking anything away from him)

what he has done his past 2 fights is beyond incredible.

BUT the major thing between the all the bullshit wasnt the money for me, it was the contract, because i am pretty sure contracts go by fights and within a certain time limit.

if couture quits he cannot fight in 9 fights he will get sued, if he retires he cant fight period, he is fucked.

he owes the ufc 2 fights bottom line, if he rejects them he will get sued for that as well, its on sherdog.com great article.

“Fifth, if all you can do is fight for a living, you have issues…try taking up a trade or working labour..Support yourself..Just like any starving student or aspiring actor. Those hours working as a waiter or janitor will not kill you. Sixth, I train Muy Thai and Vale Tudo style combat 4 times a week…So I am not talking out of my rear. I would never train for something like this as a career without backing myself up – i.e. education, second job etc”

Deyo, I had to say something about this. I am sure a huge portion of these fighters could, have, or are supplementing their incomes with other jobs. Anyone can go out and find a job to support themselves. The issue here is that we are not talking about the average every day Joe trying to make it big in MMA. We are talking about highly skilled fighters that have trained years and are putting their bodies on the line everytime they step into the octagon or ring. If you went to school to become a surgeon and got hired. When you get through your residency years the hospital says, you know what we are only going to pay you fifty thousands dollars a year. Would you be upset? I know I would. I am sure a lot of these guys have done exactly what you are saying. Now they have an opportunity to do what they have given up so much for to pay the bills. I say they should be able to.

By the way what is your name I will look for you in the next PPV.

Your hilarious….! Get debate…at least your not a knuckle like alot of people who post on this site.

“Fifth, if all you can do is fight for a living, you have issues…try taking up a trade or working labour..Support yourself..Just like any starving student or aspiring actor. Those hours working as a waiter or janitor will not kill you. Sixth, I train Muy Thai and Vale Tudo style combat 4 times a week…So I am not talking out of my rear. I would never train for something like this as a career without backing myself up – i.e. education, second job etc”

Deyo, I had to say something about this. I am sure a huge portion of these fighters could, have, or are supplementing their incomes with other jobs. Anyone can go out and find a job to support themselves. The issue here is that we are not talking about the average every day Joe trying to make it big in MMA. We are talking about highly skilled fighters that have trained years and are putting their bodies on the line everytime they step into the octagon or ring. If you went to school to become a surgeon and got hired. When you get through your residency years the hospital says, you know what we are only going to pay you fifty thousands dollars a year. Would you be upset? I know I would. I am sure a lot of these guys have done exactly what you are saying. Now they have an opportunity to do what they have given up so much for to pay the bills. I say they should be able to.

By the way what is your name I will look for you in the next PPV.

• Knuckle head *

PhilQNY
Oct 31st, 2007 at 9:26 am Quote this comment
This whole deal is BS..the thing that gets me on UFC brass..is their attitude. They are the white sharks..killa whales of MMA. Even if the $ stats are true..in a way i see Randy’s side still. Dana is living in a world above ours.

Thank you Phil, as a fellow Queens New Yorker, I hold the same view. Let’s be honest even if it is true, Randy and a list of maybe 5 other UFC fighters (Hughes, Liddell, Anderson Silva, and Franklin) are the few who are getting a percentage of PPV sales and making REAL MONEY. That leaves the other 97 % of fighters earning the mere $3,000 – $9,000 per fight if they win. It’s a complete shame and it’s very very sad.

As a fighter just to earn these “discretionary bonuses” you have to beat out essentially 7 other fights to earn A. fight of night B. sub of night or C. KO of night. Average fighter fights 3-4 times a year, muliply that by let’s call it $5,000.

THAT’S $20,000 Gross pay not net. Even with sponsorships they are not exactly living the high life, and couldn’t afford to live in Manhattan or any of the other boroughs of NEW YORK making that kind of dough. And Dana has the nerve to call these kinds PROFESSIONAL ATHLETES ? PAY THEM AS SUCH !

The guys with no names are getting paid crappy generally. The average fighter from what I have seen posted makes anywhere from $5k to show and anywhere from $10 to $12K to win. The average boxer who never headlines and fights the bix fight generally make about $2 to 3K a fight, women boxers average about $200 a round. UFC fighters really are not all that bad off. Compared to where the sport is. 3 years ago the sport was barely popular, go back 15 and very few people can say they saw the first UFC show, I know I did…What do you think those guys go back then. Compare other prof. athletes and see how much you really think other athletes make that play 160 games, or profootball, http://www.zmag.org/zmag/articles/mar99eitzen.htm
actual average of other athletes if you take out the Arods and Vick style signings are baseball—$500,000; football—$400,000; and hockey—$500,000. 19% percent of football pros make a million or over. So like 300 out of 1700 make more then a million. Then conisder 1500 kids are draft eligible every year, of some 300 will make it and then about half of that making final rosters. That is from the most popular sport in the states right now. A sport that has been developing itself throughout the decades. Look at the boxing numbers.

Considering the amount of time MMA has been around making a name for itself, and the fact that the UFC has just recently within the last 5 years or so have realy only just begun making real money they are not that bad off. Remember they choose to fight, nobody forces them. Yeah it is tough and it is hard and there is plenty of money there, but it has just started its upward climbin popularity. Hell The largest money maker in the world is Wal-Mart. They make money as a corporation then 40% of most westernized nations(Ireland off t
he top of my head is one of the standouts, wal-mart make more money then the country of ireland does)yet they barely pay min. wage, and do any of you fight for them. Maybe most of these guys will never be millionaires but many will live comfortable, if they play there cards right. UFC is a business, Randy signed a contract, Honor it. He looks more and more stupid with each press conference, with each statement-and I love Randy.

wow, the debate is already heated and overcooked. i really dont know what to say anymore concerning the truth of what happened with randy and the ufc. but now that both sides b!tch slapped eachother, hopefully they can breakup or have makeup sex. as a fan i just want something to happen, and a heavy weight title fight better not get delayed because of this pissing match.

concerning fighter paydays, for all you guys saying that $5k a fight is fine for uknown figters cause they are unproven is ridiculous. maybe 3 years ago, when the talent pool was a lot shallower i may have agreed with you. but nowadays, the ufc isnt looking for new unknown fighters that havent fought a single fight. everybody is coming from smaller feeder organizations. fighters may make $5k a fight on the smaller but still professional shows, not on the show, the ufc. and the reasoning behind this has nothing to do with morals and everything to do with the fact that ufc makes soo much money off their fights. if you choose to forget kalib starnes making only $12,000 dollars for a ppv telivised fight because he sucks, lets remember koscheck fighting gsp and only making, someting like $10,000, for a fight that was highly marketed and was almost a co-main event.

the fighters should have a union. and if they do, it really shouldnt affect my price for watching the ppv events. it should just be a little less money going to the ufc organization. if they dont form a union inside the ufc then expect the laws of free markets to sprout other mma organizations.

maybe the answer is to have more fights, weekly and televised. as a fan im most excited about this idea. if baseball can have no paperview events and pay 20 guys in each city a shit ton of money to sit around a dugout, the ufc should start moving in that direction. instead of nationally syndicating old fights, the ufc should ink a deal to nationaly syndicate new fights every week. like monday night football, im ready for thursday or tuesday night fights. the money is out there and the product is good.

ESPN said Randy got like 2.9 mill

concerning fighter paydays, for all you guys saying that $5k a fight is fine for uknown figters cause they are unproven is ridiculous. maybe 3 years ago, when the talent pool was a lot shallower i may have agreed with you. but nowadays, the ufc isnt looking for new unknown fighters that havent fought a single fight. everybody is coming from smaller feeder organizations. fighters may make $5k a fight on the smaller but still professional shows, not on the show, the ufc. and the reasoning behind this has nothing to do with morals and everything to do with the fact that ufc makes soo much money off their fights. if you choose to forget kalib starnes making only $12,000 dollars for a ppv telivised fight because he sucks, lets remember koscheck fighting gsp and only making, someting like $10,000, for a fight that was highly marketed and was almost a co-main event.

the fighters should have a union. and if they do, it really shouldnt affect my price for watching the ppv events. it should just be a little less money going to the ufc organization. if they dont form a union inside the ufc then expect the laws of free markets to sprout other mma organizations.

Your logic is seriously broken. There is more talent today so they should make more money? Basic economics tells you that the more supply you have the cheaper you can get the product. There are hundreds of fighters out there like Starnes, so why should the UFC have to pay more when the selection is higher?

Do you honestly think that if the fighters unionize and the UFC has to pay more for fighters the cost won’t be passed on to fans? If you sell a product and your suppliers raise the price you pay for materials, what will you do: Cut your profit margin to help out customers or raise your prices and keep making as much money as before? Call it greed or whatever, but it’s just good business.

Everyone needs to understand that the UFC is a business. Their job is to sell a product for as much as they possibly can while keeping their input costs as low as possible. I’m tired of fans whining that the UFC owes fighters, fans, and MMA in general something. Their only loyalty should be to do what is best for their company. If that also happens to benefit someone else involved i.e. fans, so be it.

Good article at sherdog about a standard Zuffa contract. Check it out.

http://www.sherdog.com/news/articles.asp?n_id=9734

Lots of good info here guys. You can’t renig on a zuffa contract

I’m surprised the cover letter signed by Dana doesn’t have any curse words in it. I was expecting something along the lines of:

“Dear Randy,
DO YOU WANT TO BE A FUCKIN’ FIGHTER?! WELL HERE’S TWO HUNDRED FIFTY GRAND!

Yours eternally,
Dana White

PS—Fuck."

haha.lol

Randy = foot in mouth

how is that a foot in randys mouth…he said it was about beinb lied to and not respected..not a money issue.

this is getting out of control. if the man wants to walk away at the top of the food chain and payscale in the best organization in the world to do C-caliber movies, let him.

doesn’t seem like the best idea in the world to me. he is letting a lot of people down.

Yeah, I agree. I’m just bummed out about the whole thing either way. Nobody wants to see Randy ACT, you know? I’m surprised he’s doing that, I didn’t think that was his style. Guess I was wrong.

Your logic is seriously broken. There is more talent today so they should make more money? Basic economics tells you that the more supply you have the cheaper you can get the product.

There are hundreds of fighters out there like Starnes, so why should the UFC have to pay more when the selection is higher?

Do you honestly think that if the fighters unionize and the UFC has to pay more for fighters the cost won’t be passed on to fans? If you sell a product and your suppliers raise the price you pay for materials, what will you do: Cut your profit margin to help out customers or raise your prices and keep making as much money as before? Call it greed or whatever, but it’s just good business.

Everyone needs to understand that the UFC is a business. Their job is to sell a product for as much as they possibly can while keeping their input costs as low as possible. I’m tired of fans whining that the UFC owes fighters, fans, and MMA in general something. Their only loyalty should be to do what is best for their company. If that also happens to benefit someone else involved i.e. fans, so be it.

Couldn’t agree more…I love hearing comments from people who have no sence of business or economics..and blow hot air as if they have MBA’s or something.

At the end of the day…the fighter needs to appraise themselves..If you accept to fight for 5k then shut up and fight..you dont like the terms dont sign on the dotted line.

Fighters union??? Does anyone truely understand the concept or how unions really work? Why would a union work here when it has caused problems for everyother league in professional sports? If anything a union would cause alot of issues with respect to scheduling and create havoc setting up events etc…

What these fighters need to do is educate themselves with respect to contract negociations and the legalities of this business and their interests and hire good agents to represent them. The best thing for these fighters is to help promote the sport, increase its fan base and many other organizations will be born levelling the playing field and this will offer fighters better contracts and incentives Humm lets see its started with UFC, then other people caught on – King of the Cage, Cage Rage, Elite XC and now Mark Cuban has invloved himslef with HD Net (I hope I got his name correct). Give this sport 5 more years, trust me it will be different.

As for the Josh Koscheck…Lets just see how much bigger his next contract is…. I bet you he gets better terms.

For the most part, i think many people have a hate on for UFC and Dana, because they are cashing in on a good investment and solid business plan. If anything, they took all the risks and saved this sport….I dont think this website would be as popular as it is or have as many posts or new breaks if it wasnt for them reviving the organization.

Yeah I like Randy alot but looking at the evidence on sherdog and everything else, What is he trying to do.
I’m looking forward to seeing Randys last to fights in the ufc, I mean they have to take place if he ever wants to fight again anywhere.
and lastly I’m really glad the UFC is not what was in the wrong, after all it’s the ufc and mma that will be around after Randy is gone.

News on Dan Henderson:
http://www.mmanews.com/ufc/Dan-Henderson-To-Fight-At-185-lbs.-On-UFC-79-Card.html

I wouldn’t believe this until it comes from a MUCH more reliable MMA source than Bubba the Love Sponge. I REALLY don’t think that Henderson would drop to 185 for any other fight than Anderson Silva. I mean seriously, are they going to make him drop to 185 to fight Ivan Salverry or Dean Lister? NO. If he fights at 185 it will be to unify the titles and be the first fighter to acually have a chance against the spider. PLUS, Anderson just fought like two weeks ago. He will NOT be fighting again in December. That card is alread stacked, they do not need to add another title fight to it, and they won’t. Anderson Silva vs Dan Henderson is a Main Event match up. When the fight does happen, it will be the main event.

Your logic is seriously broken. There is more talent today so they should make more money? Basic economics tells you that the more supply you have the cheaper you can get the product.

There are hundreds of fighters out there like Starnes, so why should the UFC have to pay more when the selection is higher?

Do you honestly think that if the fighters unionize and the UFC has to pay more for fighters the cost won’t be passed on to fans? If you sell a product and your suppliers raise the price you pay for materials, what will you do: Cut your profit margin to help out customers or raise your prices and keep making as much money as before? Call it greed or whatever, but it’s just good business.

Everyone needs to understand that the UFC is a business. Their job is to sell a product for as much as they possibly can while keeping their input costs as low as possible. I’m tired of fans whining that the UFC owes fighters, fans, and MMA in general something. Their only loyalty should be to do what is best for their company. If that also happens to benefit someone else involved i.e. fans, so be it.[/quote]

Thank You for explaining basic businesss. To bad more people do not realize that it is a business as well as a sport. 10k for a guy who was a nobody less then 2 years ago is not bad. koscheck’s fight against GSP was one of is last on UFC contract, then he can resign for a better deal. Koscheck is making money so I wouldn’t worry abou thim. most of the guys are getting paid.

I wouldn’t believe this until it comes from a MUCH more reliable MMA source than Bubba the Love Sponge. I REALLY don’t think that Henderson would drop to 185 for any other fight than Anderson Silva. I mean seriously, are they going to make him drop to 185 to fight Ivan Salverry or Dean Lister? NO. If he fights at 185 it will be to unify the titles and be the first fighter to acually have a chance against the spider. PLUS, Anderson just fought like two weeks ago. He will NOT be fighting again in December. That card is alread stacked, they do not need to add another title fight to it, and they won’t. Anderson Silva vs Dan Henderson is a Main Event match up. When the fight does happen, it will be the main event.

Im with you on this one.
This Hendo news has Bullshit written all over it.

The reason guys like Starnes get paid like crap is b/c there are hundreds of guys out there who would be happy to fight in the UFC for 7 grand. In fact there are a ton of guys who would fight for less. I’m not trying to dog Starnes, but you used him as an example so, 1. No one said he has to fight for 7k a fight to show 2. No one says he has to fight at all 3. Find a better job if your current job doesn’t pay the bills.

BTW, Jason Black(another B fighter) only got paid like 8k to show for his fight at UFC 77, but he also got an extra 40k for having the most exciting fight of the night. That’s my way of saying that the UFC takes care of guys who put on good fights. Almost 50k for an undercard non PPV fight is a pretty good payday. Not everyone gets that so make sure you stand out in your fight if you want a chance to earn some extra cash.

OK, I don’t know exactly how you feel about the UFC. Do you consider it a legitimate sport? Is it almost main stream like basketball, baseball, and football? I am not talking MMA in general. I am talking the UFC. It is the most notable of all MMA organizations. People who had never heard of Mixed Martial Arts know what the UFC is. It is world wide now. You ask the average everyday fan that just jumped onto the band wagon and they couldn’t tell you 3 other small organizations.

With that being said it seems to me that you do not believe this is a legitimate sport. It almost seems like you feel this is still similar to human dog fighting. I am sure you don’t feel that way but the way you explain how these fighters should be treated seems that way. I mean you are saying get over it if you don’t make more that 10 thousand dollars a fight. Where quite a bit of the money goes to training fees and who knows what else. If it is a legitimate sport then they these fighters should be treated that way.

Before baseball, basketball, and football became main stream sports their athletes were treated similarly. As soon as it became a booming business those athletes didn’t have to work second jobs anymore. It seems to me that the UFC is near that point. So getting something in place that will only help the fighters is crucial.

I also understand that there are many many other fithers out there that could fight in the UFC. You don’t think that the NBA, NFL, and MLB have the same issue. It is a business and in a business there are only a certain number of spots that that company has to fill. You can still get new fighters every year. I mean sign these guys to one year contracts. If they don’t pan out don’t resign them. It is business plain and simple.

At the end of the day…the fighter needs to appraise themselves..If you accept to fight for 5k then shut up and fight..you dont like the terms dont sign on the dotted line.
(“I agree with this. The way the UFC is ran at this time the fighters definitely need to be more careful with how they structure their contracts.”)

Fighters union??? Does anyone truely understand the concept or how unions really work? Why would a union work here when it has caused problems for everyother league in professional sports? If anything a union would cause alot of issues with respect to scheduling and create havoc setting up events etc…
(“I can see how there could be scheduling issues and what not with a fighters union. There are many positives about keeping the UFC the way it is and many negatives. The same with moving to a fighters union. There is always going to be negative factors in any business decision. The thing about a fighters union is that it will assure the athletes of a yearly salary. To me this is a good thing. A lot of the up and comers can do this for a living. They don’t have to work an 8 hour day and then hit the gym for 3-4 hours to train. They can focus purely on training. Which to me makes a huge difference in any athletes performance. To me the fighters that are fighting for the UFC are the elite guys. At least that is what the UFC thinks.”)

What these fighters need to do is educate themselves with respect to contract negociations and the legalities of this business and their interests and hire good agents to represent them. The best thing for these fighters is to help promote the sport, increase its fan base and many other organizations will be born levelling the playing field and this will offer fighters better contracts and incentives Humm lets see its started with UFC, then other people caught on – King of the Cage, Cage Rage, Elite XC and now Mark Cuban has invloved himslef with HD Net (I hope I got his name correct). Give this sport 5 more years, trust me it will be different.
("You are right it will be different in 5 years. I hope for the better. As for the contract and agent issues you are right about that as well. The problem is that getting the right agent is like hiring the right lawyer or like Forest Gump says, “life is like a box of chocolates. You never know what you’re gonna to get”. It is the same with an agent you may get a bad chocolate but you don’t know because you can’t see into the future.")

For the most part, i think many people have a hate on for UFC and Dana, because they are cashing in on a good investment and solid business plan. If anything, they took all the risks and saved this sport….I dont think this website would be as popular as it is or have as many posts or new breaks if it wasnt for them reviving the organization.

(“I definitely don’t hate Zuffa and the UFC. They have built this sport that I much enjoy watching into a juggernaut. I have a ton of respect for those guys to put it all on the line for something that they believed in. That takes balls. I make these statements because I feel that the sport may suffer if it stays as is.”)

OK, I don’t know exactly how you feel about the UFC. Do you consider it a legitimate sport? Is it almost main stream like basketball, baseball, and football? I am not talking MMA in general. I am talking the UFC. It is the most notable of all MMA organizations. People who had never heard of Mixed Martial Arts know what the UFC is. It is world wide now. You ask the average everyday fan that just jumped onto the band wagon and they couldn’t tell you 3 other small organizations.

With that being said it seems to me that you do not believe this is a legitimate sport. It almost seems like you feel this is still similar to human dog fighting. I am sure you don’t feel that way but the way you explain how these fighters should be treated seems that way. I mean you are saying get over it if you don’t make more that 10 thousand dollars a fight. Where quite a bit of the money goes to training fees and who knows what else. If it is a legitimate sport then they these fighters should be treated that way.

Before baseball, basketball, and football became main stream sports their athletes were treated similarly. As soon as it became a booming business those athletes didn’t have to work second jobs anymore. It seems to me that the UFC is near that point. So getting something in place that will only help the fighters is crucial.

I also understand that there are many many other fithers out there that could fight in the UFC. You don’t think that the NBA, NFL, and MLB have the same issue. It is a business and in a business there are only a certain number of spots that that company has to fill. You can still get new fighters every year. I mean sign these guys to one year contracts. If they don’t pan out don’t resign them. It is business plain and simple.

To answer your questions:

Do is consider MMA a sport? Yes.

Do I consider the UFC a sport? No, I consider the UFC a company that is in the business of making money off the sport of MMA.

Is it almost main stream like basketball, baseball, and football? MMA is becoming more mainstream everyday, primarily through the efforts of the UFC.

But, do I consider the NFL, MLB, or NBA a sport? No. I do consider basketball, baseball, and football a sport but those organizations are businesses whose goal is to make money from the product they sell(i.e. games). The minute you start paying employees(athletes) and start charging people to watch it stops being a sport and becomes a business.

Basically anything else people do in life can basically can be broken down into two categories.

1.) If you are willing to do something and either pay to do it or get no money in return it is a hobby.

2.) The minute you do something in an effort to make money for doing it, it is now a job and no longer a hobby. Athletes say they love what they do and wouldn’t want to do anything else. That’s fine, but the real truth is that there is nothing else they would rather do at their current salary. I like my job, but there is no way I would go to work 40 hrs a week if I didn’t get a satisfactory paycheck. That makes it a job. UFC fans should look at fighters the exact same way. The fact that being an athlete takes physical skills in no way changes the fact that it is a job.

Unless there is a photo of Randy holding this said piece of paper you should not take it as 100% that Randy has even seen this payslip, not saying he hasn’t but its hard to judge.

All will be revealed in due course no doubt.

Be nice to see Randy stand and defend his title though.

Randy will fight his last two fights and if he doesn’t and he gets sued then it really wasn’t about the money. For me to believe Randy/UFC is hard because there are things that we all don’t see. Look at official money exchanging, signatures, he said; they said. Losing some respect for Randy is tough but wtf is he doing? Time will tell and we will all find out the bitter truth soon. UFC is huge and and careful with contracts and $$$$$$$ but sometimes it’s the big players that have the push and pull. Hang in fans

To answer your questions:

Do is consider MMA a sport? Yes.

Do I consider the UFC a sport? No, I consider the UFC a company that is in the business of making money off the sport of MMA.

Is it almost main stream like basketball, baseball, and football? MMA is becoming more mainstream everyday, primarily through the efforts of the UFC.

But, do I consider the NFL, MLB, or NBA a sport? No. I do consider basketball, baseball, and football a sport but those organizations are businesses whose goal is to make money from the product they sell(i.e. games). The minute you start paying employees(athletes) and start charging people to watch it stops being a sport and becomes a business.

Basically anything else people do in life can basically can be broken down into two categories.

1.) If you are willing to do something and either pay to do it or get no money in return it is a hobby.

2.) The minute you do something in an effort to make money for doing it, it is now a job and no longer a hobby. Athletes say they love what they do and wouldn’t want to do anything else. That’s fine, but the real truth is that there is nothing else they would rather do at their current salary. I like my job, but there is no way I would go to work 40 hrs a week if I didn’t get a satisfactory paycheck. That makes it a job. UFC fans should look at fighters the exact same way. The fact that being an athlete takes physical skills in no way changes the fact that it is a job.

You are right about the UFC being a business not a sport. I should have stated that better in my previous post.

Other than that I agree with what you have said but am unclear on where you stand as to my previous statements. It sounds like we are on the same page. The fighters of the UFC are employees and as I have been saying all along should be treated as such.

it is a shame that ufc fighters don’t get paid as much as other mainstream athletes. this is true. i’m a die-hard fan myself and i absolutely think they should get paid bigger bucks for the punishment they endure. but the fact of the matter is that the ufc does not get as much national coverage as football, baseball, basketball, or even golf. they have 1-2 ppv events every month where as teams in the sports mentioned above can have live games 2-3 times a week throughout the season.

true, randy isn’t making 10-20 million a fight like de la hoya, or tyson from a single match..but tell me. but he’s still made close to 3 mil for 2 fights this year without any endorsement $‘s included. i’m not sure if randy himself can note anyone who’s made more than that off of 2 fights. everyone keeps talking about fedor’s signing bonus but IMO that’s just all talk. it’s easy to look at randy getting paid just 250k for a fight and then see cropcop come along and get 300k for beating up eddie sanchez. what people fail to see is that cropcop doesn’t receive any backend for the ppv.

randy comes out on national TV and states that he a) didn’t get a signing bonus b) received 500k for ppv c) other fighter were getting offered more receiving more bonus

well, i saw the paystubs and not randy receive a 500k signing bonus, but his ppv bonus was off by 440k. so that’s randy coming out at his press conference on national tv and misquoting what he got paid by a whopping $1,000,000. i’d say that’s a pretty big mistake on randy’s part to miss a million dollars in checks that he signed and cashed.

the bottom line is…all rumors aside, who’s actually making more money than randy couture right now in the ufc? cro cop? big nog? chuck liddell? tito ortiz? anderson silva? anyone? i’ve heard other people comment saying that this is the breaking point and as the mma world progesses it will eventually be that fighters actually will get paid big money just like other mainstream sports. the ufc and mma are bigger now than they were before but they’re still not mainstream. and only 3 years ago, the majority of people didn’t even know who couture and liddell were. but there sports come along way since then and mma is about to explode no doubt. just 2 years ago rich franklin was the the #1 middleweight in the world and was considered one of the top spots for best p4p fighter inthe world. does anyone know what his contract was for each fight? it was 16,000 to fight and 16,000 to win. that’s 32k for the one of the best middleweights at the time.

i’m a huge fan of couture…but he’s unhappy about making more than a million per fight when no one has yet to prove that they’re making more on paper. it’s a little disappointing… the sport has come such a long way and it’s only going to get better. there’s not 1 person in the ufc that has been promoted more than randy couture. he’s coached TUF twice, commentated numerous events, and had a 3-4 special dedicated to him on spike tv. can anyone else match that on their resume? i think not.

also, you negotiate a contract and don’t sign unless you are happy with the terms. you don’t say you’re unhappy with a contract after you’ve already fought twice and received close to 3 mil b/c you heard a ‘rumor’ that fedor was offered more as a signing bonus. randy is who he is today b/c of the platform the ufc has become and the opponents and opportunitues that the ufc has provided him. not one other organization has a another fighter as recognizable as couture who has had as much success – with fedor as the exception. but what about fedor? yes, he’s practically unbeaten throughout his career. but who has he really fought in the recent years other than crocop??

we made fedor. we think fedor is a machine. he hasn’t proved it yet against #1 contender after #1 contender. he hasn’t even come close to fighting the best of the best in retaining his title. i love watching fedor, but he’s very overrated. would i love him to come to the ufc and wipe everyone out? absolutely. i think he could do it as well. could he beat? absolutely.

thosd esignatures on the checks are totatlly different look at all of them if i’ma bank teller i’m not using a check this large without him RANDY signing it infront of me or good proof that this is his signature….come on

Don’t let the wife do your talking! HUGE mistake! She will get half in the end!